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Is “data scientist” the new “programmer”?

blogs.harvard.edu

121–130 of 246 posts

Re: Is “data scientist” the new “programmer”?

#121

I wonder why "data engineer" isn't one of the suggested terms. Scientists do not really program science, nor do programmers research programs, as their respective fields of expertise.

My current job title is "Data Engineer", before this role I was a "Process Engineer". In my opinion those two jobs are actually pretty similar.

When I was working in process engineering I was trying to optimize the outputs from our industrial process on a day to day basis in this role broadly speaking I try to optimize the data extracted from the same industrial process.

Mostly I'm concerned with how can we extract data out of our plant, how do we represent and present that data (particularly to operators and technicians) and how can we better recognize and respond to underlying trends in the data.

Before I assumed the role (in 2011) my predecessor, who had a background as a statistician, was called a 'Process Statistician' so I assume my Manager changed the job title to reflect my background as an Engineer (Materials Engineering in my case).

Re: Is “data scientist” the new “programmer”?

#122

I would say "data engineer" is the new programmer, in that programming is evolving away from procedural monolithic threaded code with locks everywhere, to distributed message processing pipelines whose capacity can be flexibly adjusted, etc. "Data scientist" is an actual role at some companies but most data scientists are actually struggling with the contradiction between what they learned in school and the harsh rea…

So data engineering would be a subset of software engineering?

Re: Is “data scientist” the new “programmer”?

#123

What I took from the post was not that a "data scientist" qualifies as a "programmer" in the modern sense, but in the sense of the kinds of things programmers did in the 1970s. And maybe he's expressing some nostalgia for those times. I learned programming around 1982. I didn't pursue a programming career, but went to college and majored in math and physics. Today I often use programming in the way that a data scient…

Yes, "data scientist" is the new "70's programmer"... write some code in one file that runs within a hosting system (mainframe, spark).

Regarding the complexity and tedium of many production code bases I think they got there because many developers don't have the ability (experience) or opportunity (iterations) to do things simply.

Re: Is “data scientist” the new “programmer”?

#124

This post states that a data scientist uses compact languages such as SQL and R. Genuine question - do people really believe that being able to write and understand complex SQL makes you a data scientist? I ask because, I've been writing some of the nastiest, most difficult looking SQL around for probably at least 15 years. And yet, I would NOT call myself a data scientist because I know and can work with data and us…

> do people really believe that being able to write and understand complex SQL makes you a data scientist?

Many data scientists use R and SQL, that does not mean that many of those who use R and or SQL are data scientists.

Many lawyers use word. Yes I’m not a lawyer just because I use word.

Re: Is “data scientist” the new “programmer”?

#125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hah! At my company a decent proportion of engineers spend their lives scrambling to productionalize and operate the Lovecraftian concoctions of R and Python that our data scientists cook up on their laptops.

It's scary how much this comment applies to my current job. Literally just spent today discussing with entire engineering org how to steer away from this behavior.

why?

Re: Is “data scientist” the new “programmer”?

#127
The take down on abstraction and software engineers (by using Java as an example) is similar to saying "back in the day to find a prime number we would simply use a sieve, but today it is a tedium, what with all the pi's and e's and thetas that get in the way, and what are geometry and polynomials doing here, and what in the god's name is this i, I just want to count the prime numbers which are nice round whole numbers".

That's what happens when a topic grows from being a curiosity where dilettantes dabble into a proper field that is applied to solve problems. Granted, some of the developments can indeed be tedious and self indulgent, but otherwise this is the natural progression. Its sad and frustrating when people who ought to know better make such statements. Is it done to provoke a critical analysis, positive trolling if you will?

About the role of data scientist, I find it both amusing and disappointing that just about anyone with a three week MOOC gets to work in this field, who otherwise had never dealt with statistics before. I mean, statistics is a three year long grueling applied maths degree, and condensing it to three weeks is silly. It is actually in this way that it is similar to progamming job of the 90s (I don't know how it was in the 70's, I wasn't born yet). Just about anyone who could learn Java or VisualBasic, or the self taught cowboys who used C, ended up programming professionally. Actually it was not that bad, for coding is not as hard as its made to be, but that until they got sucker punched by the n squared complexity, to say the least, on a big data. Coding couldn't help them and they realized programming was more than learning to code and using some API's and system calls. (I was one of them in a way, when I started to code in C++ to model and simulate my mechanical engineering project, and it lead me to the path of enlightenment.) So, today's data scientists who are not bonafide statistics graduates or statisticians have it coming as well, whatever the analogue is, unless they are merely "data monkeys" in which case all is well and as expected.

Re: Is “data scientist” the new “programmer”?

#128

Sure, we’ve stolen the term “engineer” for long enough, let’s bother the scientists now.

Why is software engineering not a valid engineering? I worked on both software and hardware engineering and general principles seem to be the same. You deal with complexity and simplify it by making abstractions. You make calculations to make sure your project is feasible. It's not like EE and Aerospace engineering are literally the same field but there are some principles shared in those fields, and with software en…

Education is one particular difference. With few exceptions, engineering jobs require an engineering degree, and consequently an ability to basic engineering math and understand basic physics. The same cannot be said of software

Re: Is “data scientist” the new “programmer”?

#129

Deming, from Out of the Crisis (1986): People with master's degrees in statistical theory accept jobs in industry and government to work with computers. It is a vicious cycle. Statisticians do not know what statistical work is, and are satisfied to work with computers. People that hire statisticians likewise have no knowledge about statistical work, and somehow suppose that computers are the answer. Statisticians and…

Fascinating quote. Indeed misperception of job function is a problem here and in many fields.

I think you're right, though. Business people don't care much about statistical significance, so what's the point? We can just take the sample mean to see what is best. And recommendations? Whatever is most popular. What's contributing to the change in revenue? Let's look at the alignment of the planets

Re: Is “data scientist” the new “programmer”?

#130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like you are roughly describing research programmers versus system administrators or operators in academic computing environments. I think a big difference between research programmers and production/ops people is that as researchers we often chase a transient goal. Build some complex and horrible integration to compute a result or put something in a paper. We used to call these Rube Goldberg machines rather t…

I’m not referring to transient research prototypes, but to robust long-lived systems needed for experimentation and reproducible results tracking, and services that are directly customer facing. We are often required to create new services and functionality because it is how our company can grow, and we have to have ease of access to experimental working space, with freedom to do things like custom compilations of ML…

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