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Life in the Spanish city that banned cars

theguardian.com

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Re: Life in the Spanish city that banned cars

#521

Post by Sharlin »

CompelTechnic wrote: post #282
deelowe wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As one of these so called "white flight" people, I can't describe how much such statements frustrate me. I didn't move from the city because I'm a racist or don't want to be around people of color. I don't want to be around people period . Living in the city stresses me out. The constant noise, the issues with drunk people randomly knocking on my door at 2am, the couple of times I woke up to people fighting in the pa…

There are good reasons to believe that highly urban environments are bad for your mental health (in ways that I think are worse than how bad they are for your physical health). Sometimes I feel like strong advocates of increasingly-dense construction feel that the denser your lifestyle, the more prosocial your behavior. Maybe these advocates are among the most extraverted people, and they have little experience with…

And to what extent the hostility of urban environments is due to cars and car-centric planning hostile to human-scale activity? The whole point of new urbanism is creating livable, hospitable urban environments, and usually people-friendliness means car-unfriendliness.

Your generic suburbs have their own problems – massively artificial, claustrophobic rows and rows of almost identical houses, with zero character and nowhere to go without a car.

Re: Life in the Spanish city that banned cars

#522

Post by kevstev »

nrjames wrote: post #100

Raleigh converted Fayetteville Street to pedestrian only back in 1977. It ended up killing all of the businesses there. https://www.wral.com/news/local/story/163829/ The city reopened it to traffic, however, and "revitalized" the area, resulting in a booming downtown economy: https://www.metrojacksonville.com/article/2007-may-learning-... I love pedestrian districts in cities. Copenhagen comes to mind. However, pedes…

Contrary to that anecdote, Jersey City (across the Hudson river from Manhattan), created a no-car zone near one of its busier subway stops and what was once a dead-zone after 8pm is now an extremely vibrant place filled with bars, restaurants and shops.

Proximity to mass transit and having density that already discourages driving helps.

Re: Life in the Spanish city that banned cars

#523

Post by guelo »

corndoge wrote: post #466
sunshinelackof wrote: post #431

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even Portland and Eugene love to boast how bicycle friendly they are, but neither are really commutable by anything besides a car for most people. Which is why most cyclists are so prolific -- it's hard to be a cyclist by circumstance. Riding your bike inherently comes with crossing a dozen intersections beaming with cars that treat you like you don't belong on the road. A solution is to level the planes of separatio…

Cyclists really don't belong on the road. It's such an odd collective viewpoint that a vehicle which virtually always travels far below the speed limit should be allowed alongside vehicles that travel at the speed limit. I think this is because we conflate the benefits of cycling and the value of making our public infrastructure amenable to cycling with the opinion that cyclists should share highways with cars. It's…

Disagree, slow the cars down. I've seen good results with "road diets" where 4-lane roads are converted to two lanes for cars and more space for bike lanes and center turning lanes. Also, adding pedestrian activated lights to stop cars.

Re: Life in the Spanish city that banned cars

#524

Post by deelowe »

Sharlin wrote: post #242
deelowe wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As one of these so called "white flight" people, I can't describe how much such statements frustrate me. I didn't move from the city because I'm a racist or don't want to be around people of color. I don't want to be around people period . Living in the city stresses me out. The constant noise, the issues with drunk people randomly knocking on my door at 2am, the couple of times I woke up to people fighting in the pa…

Call it "middle-class flight" if you want. The end result is the same.

I have no issue with that. I just don't like being labeled a racist.

Re: Life in the Spanish city that banned cars

#525

Post by deelowe »

oftenwrong wrote: post #323
amyjess wrote: post #289

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree wholeheartedly with you; like you I'm a proud suburbanite who can't tolerate cities, noise, and people, and to that I'll add one thing... > Amazingly, non white people feel this way too... On this note, almost the entire Asian population of the Dallas area lives in the suburbs, and those who can afford it are starting to move to the exurbs. Only people without the means to leave are staying in the city becaus…

This article is about a city that doesn't suck, largely because it was made car-free. Not much "noise" when cars are gone.

Almost none of the noise issues I experienced while living in the city was from automobiles.

Re: Life in the Spanish city that banned cars

#526

Post by anticensor »

masklinn wrote: post #138
dmos62 wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seconded, Ghent in belgium is also pretty cool car-wise. It has so-called pedestrian-centric planning. For example, the city centre may not be entered with a car, only by foot, bicycle or public transport. It's great. I enjoyed Musk's Boring Company's presentation, where they talk about some problems with transportation today and present some solutions, with emphasis on transportation within city borders [0]. [0] htt…

> Seconded, Ghent in belgium is also pretty cool car-wise. It has so-called pedestrian-centric planning. For example, the city centre may not be entered with a car, only by foot, bicycle or public transport. It's great. Louvain La Neuve (in french-speaking belgium) has an interesting take on this: the entire city is on a concrete slab, topside is entirely pedestrian, and underslab hosts car streets and parkings.

This technique will not work in less developed countries as one misplaced building is enough to break entire city.

Re: Life in the Spanish city that banned cars

#528

Post by timerol »

briandear wrote: post #357
Sharlin wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, that's the problem with the tyranny of the majority. The fact that people want unsustainable living doesn't mean unsustainable living should be encouraged. See also Hume's guillotine [1] [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Is%E2%80%93ought_problem

How exactly is it unsustainable? Are we running out of something? Are we running out of electricity? The idea that cars are unsustainable is ridiculous. Just because they may not fit into sonmeone’s desire for increased government control of mobility doesn’t make them unsustainable. Every generation seems to think their generation will be the last, unless we “do” something. They were likely debating horse carts in En…

> Are we running out of something?

Yeah, money. In the US, new transportation projects are generally financed with federal help, while maintenance is left to the local government. This essentially creates a Ponzi scheme, where cities are going bankrupt due to depreciation on infrastructure, and not even realizing it. https://www.strongtowns.org/the-growth-ponzi-scheme/

In my opinion, roads are essentially underpriced. They're expensive to maintain and given out for free. (Similar arguments apply for parking, expressed humorously here: http://cityobservatory.org/parking-where-we-embrace-socialis...) This bothers me, as someone who doesn't own a car but lives with worse air quality and safety due to those who do.

Re: Life in the Spanish city that banned cars

#529

Post by greymeister »

screye wrote: post #376
alkonaut wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> cars (especially privately owned ones) just do not make sense going forward Inside cities that is. One must remember that a lot of the people that move around in a city every day don't live in the city. And for many of them a car is a requirement anyway. For me the car is a sunk cost - I have it for the rare times I need it (I don't need it to go into the city), but buying/maintaining/insuring it is mostly a fixed…

Won't something like rental cars make more sense in such a case ?

Not at their current price point.

Re: Life in the Spanish city that banned cars

#530

Post by anthk »

eloycoto wrote: post #296
anthk wrote: post #228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pontevedra mild climate? MediteWHAT? Please, take a map of Spain and comment again. Spain among Portugal is what you see when you cross over the Atlantic from the US. Pontevedra is in Galicia, northern Spain. Here it rains like UK, and even worse. No Sun except a very few weeks a year. Not all Spain is sunny, and not all the US is like California, Texas or Florida. You would freeze in Castille or Aragon in Winter. Yo…

Not really true this one :-) The last 10 years there are no longer rains, and the sun is here from late May to October, last year we have big wildfires in the last weekend of October, water restrictions from Sept due to the drought. I remember when I was 10 years old rain a lot, nowadays no more than London ( I lived in London for a year). Regards

That's due global warming. Also, the UK will have a shift too, soon :) Recent years have been warmer in Bilbao, too. But... still gray skys and rainy days at least twice a week.
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