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The European Union versus the Internet

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81–90 of 211 posts

Re: The European Union versus the Internet

#81
post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't use any social media, how is that ineffective?

You're still tracked, analyzed, and targeted both on and off the web by thousands of companies. Not to mention government snooping and surveillance. Even the social media giants which you deliberately never signed up for are still collecting and monetizing data on you.

Oh I see what you mean. Does this change if you don't use any of Google's products ie. web browser, youtube or search engines?

Re: The European Union versus the Internet

#82
post #18

In my network of friends, which is within the EU and comprised entirely of EU citizens and spans multiple EU tech companies from dinky startups to Giant Unicorn, GDPR has been almost universally approved. We had to implement it, and generally feel better for having done so. The Giant Unicorn employees were dismayed by how little time they were given for such a giant task, but were in support of the law. Everybody is…

I 100% agree with this. GDPR is a shining beacon of success and it blows my mind that it came from the same clowns that made the cookie law. They covered my internet with cookie banner graffiti and now they want to mess with something as fundamental as a hyperlink.

> and now they want to mess with something as fundamental as a hyperlink.

Unless I'm missing something, basic hyperlinking seems to be excluded from the scope of the new directive, and it is instead targeting services that reproduce the publication more substantially.

Recital 33:

> This protection [granted to press publications] does not extend to acts of hyperlinking.

Article 11, paragraph 2a:

> The rights referred to in paragraph 1 shall not extend to mere hyperlinks which are accompanied by individual words.

http://www.europarl.europa.eu/sides/getDoc.do?pubRef=-//EP//...

Re: The European Union versus the Internet

#83
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But we, as technologists, should always decry heavy-handed government regulation of the internet, especially as an early step. This is not an early step. The trend has been clear for the past decade, and it has been going in the wrong direction, at increasing speeds. This is pretty much something the tech industry brought upon itself by trying to always trying to outdo itself in terms of how much tracking and priva…

>The trend has been clear for the past decade, and it has been going in the wrong direction, at increasing speeds. Tools to block tracking have gotten better. Spyware is more difficult to spread, etc. I'm not convinced it's going the wrong direction "at increasing speeds". Do you have any empirical evidence of this or is it just based on perception? >IOW, from a techie to another: cry me a river. Don't do this. " Ple…

>> The trend has been clear for the past decade, and it has been going in the wrong direction, at increasing speeds.

> Tools to block tracking have gotten better. Spyware is more difficult to spread, etc. I'm not convinced it's going the wrong direction "at increasing speeds". Do you have any empirical evidence of this or is it just based on perception?

To make an analogy, what you're saying is similar to saying "I'm not convinced violent crime is going in the wrong direction, because people many people are regularly wearing better bullet-proof vests."

Better tools to block tracking is part of a trend going in the wrong direction: an arms race between trackers and anti-tracking blockers. If things were going in the right direction, we wouldn't need better blockers, since the tracking companies would have taken the hint, and either become opt in or respect simple measures like DNT headers.

Re: The European Union versus the Internet

#84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the maximum penalty = always penalty sort of misunderstanding tends to appear when programmers look at the law. Technical people tend to look at the laws in a technical way. Does this equal a violation or does it not? If it does, what will it cost? Judicious opinion or "We'll know it when we see it" rarely sits well with those of us who are used to cementing behavior into lines of code. Existing laws we alrea…

Existing laws we already operate under have much more severe maximum penalties than people realize, and judges are (relatively) reasonable at applying them correctly. I don't think the system is working well at all. We have a situation where vague laws with severe penalties allow prosecutors to grossly overcharge. This is then used to coerce the accused into waiving their rights to a trial, in return for the certaint…

To echo the other comment - this isn't familiar to me in the UK either.

Guilty pleas do usually result in lower tariffs, but AFAICT we have little to none of the horse-trading that's continually portrayed on US television.

Re: The European Union versus the Internet

#85
The only part about these EU types of laws that kinda rubs me the wrong way is how they infect across business dealings. But overall I support their objectives, even if I think the true solution to some of the problems they're trying to solve is a technical change to how the web and internet work.

Re: The European Union versus the Internet

#86
post #78
post #18

In my network of friends, which is within the EU and comprised entirely of EU citizens and spans multiple EU tech companies from dinky startups to Giant Unicorn, GDPR has been almost universally approved. We had to implement it, and generally feel better for having done so. The Giant Unicorn employees were dismayed by how little time they were given for such a giant task, but were in support of the law. Everybody is…

I disagree with the GDPR "success story" part of your comment. So far it's backfired entirely. The goal was to provide users with more control, and (from the standpoint of such a user) to reduce relentless personal data harvesting. That hasn't happened. What's happened is more annoying "we use cookies and track you"-banners all over the internet. As a user who doesn't use cookies, these damned things won't even go aw…

AIUI the "allow being tracked to gain access" is unlawful.

Re: The European Union versus the Internet

#87
post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're still tracked, analyzed, and targeted both on and off the web by thousands of companies. Not to mention government snooping and surveillance. Even the social media giants which you deliberately never signed up for are still collecting and monetizing data on you.

Oh I see what you mean. Does this change if you don't use any of Google's products ie. web browser, youtube or search engines?

I don't know how wide their web is. I know they have partnerships with some third parties, presumably some involves tracking that data.

Re: The European Union versus the Internet

#88
post #18

In my network of friends, which is within the EU and comprised entirely of EU citizens and spans multiple EU tech companies from dinky startups to Giant Unicorn, GDPR has been almost universally approved. We had to implement it, and generally feel better for having done so. The Giant Unicorn employees were dismayed by how little time they were given for such a giant task, but were in support of the law. Everybody is…

I 100% agree with this. GDPR is a shining beacon of success and it blows my mind that it came from the same clowns that made the cookie law. They covered my internet with cookie banner graffiti and now they want to mess with something as fundamental as a hyperlink.

Cookie law is still relevant. The only difference is that now companies can actually get penalties for not complying with those rules. Previously it wasn't really enforced. Without consent no 3rd party scripts and content that can track visitor should be loaded, and once the change period of 1 year passes, a lot of sites ignoring this will start receiving well deserved penalties.

Re: The European Union versus the Internet

#89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lets pass a law that states all laws must be written in Haskell! Best part about it is much fewer laws will be written since so few understand that language.

> Best part about it is much fewer laws will be written since so few understand that language. Legalese didn't seem to have that effect.

Yea but you can throw legalese madlibs into a document and get it passed as law as long as you provide the legislators enough kickbacks.

Haskell has to compile at least, and be pure and stuff.

Who's up for a Pure Functional Programming government.

Re: The European Union versus the Internet

#90
post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Idk how you can argue the EU values people over corporate interest while this copyright law is on it's way to being passed. Here's one of the many articles about what's wrong with it. https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2018/06/eus-copyright-proposal...

It's one of thousands of laws, but sure, this one is the definitive indicator of the EU's values. Maybe we could try to find a single US law that we don't like and dismiss America just as readily?

We all know you're going to pick the Patriot Act :)
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