Federal chokehold on marijuana stymies studies on epilepsy, autism • Hacker News Board

Re: Federal chokehold on marijuana stymies studies on epilepsy, autism

#31

Post by Broken_Hippo » Tue, Sep 11, 2018, 2:43 PM UTC

stephengillie wrote: post #24

maze-le wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is one thing to share a movie and possibly be fined with XXX$ because of "piracy". Its quite another thing to risk your respectability, career and future research funding -- all hanging in the balance when a federal felony charge is thrust upon you.

Isn't piracy also a federal crime, thus the FBI warning on all non-pirated DVDs?

Crimes have different sorts of consequences. A drug felony will usually haunt folks for life.

A doctor or pharmacist will likely lose their license - even if they don't, most places won't employ them. Slews of places won't employ them after that drug charge. Some places withhold benefits and some will turn them down for housing. Yes, some of this happens with other crimes as well, but there are special restrictions for folks convicted of drug crimes in many places.

Most folks caught for piracy wind up with a lawsuit instead of a felony from the government. I couldn't find numbers with a quick google search of how many folks actually got a criminal charge instead of a lawsuit, honestly - most of the articles talk about getting sued and being "guilty" in that respect.

Getting sued has completely different consequences. You might not pass a background check (so you might not have your research position), but it might not affect you much. You do not have to check the "have you ever been convicted of a felony" box that is popular in many states. And so on.

Re: Federal chokehold on marijuana stymies studies on epilepsy, autism

#32

Post by e40 » Tue, Sep 11, 2018, 2:44 PM UTC

nopacience wrote: post #27

> In March, Insys launched a multinational study of 190 children to evaluate cannabidiol as a first-line therapy for infantile spasms. We are eager to see how well the compound performs when given in the first days and weeks of the condition. If it turns out to be effective, cannabidiol would represent a substantial improvement over current drugs, all of which have serious side effects: One, for example, causes irrev…

This shows the derangement of the people in charge.

Why is this? Why this derangement on the subject of cannabis? I've read a fair amount, and every time I've brought it up, I get downvoted to hell. So, I'll ask:

Anyone have a hypothesis on why a large number of our leaders, who happen to be older white men, are insanely against this plant?

Re: Federal chokehold on marijuana stymies studies on epilepsy, autism

#33

Post by ivl » Tue, Sep 11, 2018, 2:44 PM UTC

hoorayimhelping wrote: post #21

r_singh wrote: post #5

Pardon me if this sounds naive, but I'm slightly confused as to how recreational marijuana is legal in 9 states but the DEA still heavily controls cannabidiol as if it were still illegal?

Not naive at all. The issue is typically framed as States Rights and it's wrapped around the 10th amendment: The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people. This has been an issue since the 1780s, so it will take more than a couple of sentences to give the whole rundown but it's like this. A few states ar…

Honestly between peyote (mescaline), LSD, and marijuana you've got half of schedule one being ridiculous punishments against drugs that can be used relatively safely. Half of the schedule 1 drugs hardly even need regulation.

Re: Federal chokehold on marijuana stymies studies on epilepsy, autism

#34

Post by Thriptic » Tue, Sep 11, 2018, 2:46 PM UTC

stephengillie wrote: post #23

Thriptic wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Marijuana is defined as a schedule one drug by the DEA, meaning they believe it has no accepted medical value and should not be studied. Being in possession of or trying to purchase this drug for a medical study would therefore be illegal. Publishing the results would be admitting you performed a federal crime and you would be arrested. Additionally, human studies require approval by an on site or third party institu…

But the study would be okay if they merely interviewed individuals who purchased cannabis for their own recreation? What if these individuals were using it recreationally according to a schedule suggested by the interviewers?

Suggesting that study participants use a drug of unknown purity, composition, and dosing would definitely not be ok or safe. Encouraging illegal activity generally is not ok. Interviewing self-professed users without instructing them to use the drug would likely be ok but of limited value.

Re: Federal chokehold on marijuana stymies studies on epilepsy, autism

#35

Post by honkycat » Tue, Sep 11, 2018, 2:50 PM UTC

Everyone confused about the fucked up laws around drug control and the like in the united states:

It is about locking up poor people in order to keep them from voting.

It is about filling our prisons with non-violent offenders so we can force them to work for slave wages, and line the owners of the prisons and the politicians they fund's pockets.

It's about political suppression, not about some moralistic crusade to protect people from drugs.

"The Nixon campaign in 1968, and the Nixon White House after that, had two enemies: the antiwar left and black people. You understand what I’m saying? We knew we couldn’t make it illegal to be either against the war or black, but by getting the public to associate the hippies with marijuana and blacks with heroin, and then criminalizing both heavily, we could disrupt those communities. We could arrest their leaders, raid their homes, break up their meetings, and vilify them night after night on the evening news. Did we know we were lying about the drugs? Of course we did." - John Ehrlichman

Re: Federal chokehold on marijuana stymies studies on epilepsy, autism

#36

Post by existencebox » Tue, Sep 11, 2018, 2:50 PM UTC

e40 wrote: post #32

nopacience wrote: post #27

> In March, Insys launched a multinational study of 190 children to evaluate cannabidiol as a first-line therapy for infantile spasms. We are eager to see how well the compound performs when given in the first days and weeks of the condition. If it turns out to be effective, cannabidiol would represent a substantial improvement over current drugs, all of which have serious side effects: One, for example, causes irrev…

This shows the derangement of the people in charge. Why is this? Why this derangement on the subject of cannabis? I've read a fair amount, and every time I've brought it up, I get downvoted to hell. So, I'll ask: Anyone have a hypothesis on why a large number of our leaders, who happen to be older white men, are insanely against this plant?

No need to hypothesize. The rampup of the drug war under Nixon was largely to attack blacks, hippies (antiwar), and other counterculture figures. [0]

"We could arrest their leaders. raid their homes, break up their meetings, and vilify them night after night on the evening news. Did we know we were lying about the drugs? Of course we did." (John Ehrlichman, Nixon's domestic policy chief)

In the interim, it became a wedge issue and via "tough on crime", an extension of certain party platforms, (also in that it has effectively become the status quo for some population segments) and I think persists largely as some combination of the above.

[0] https://www.cnn.com/2016/03/23/politics/john-ehrlichman-rich...

Re: Federal chokehold on marijuana stymies studies on epilepsy, autism

#37

Post by tekromancr » Tue, Sep 11, 2018, 2:50 PM UTC

e40 wrote: post #32

nopacience wrote: post #27

> In March, Insys launched a multinational study of 190 children to evaluate cannabidiol as a first-line therapy for infantile spasms. We are eager to see how well the compound performs when given in the first days and weeks of the condition. If it turns out to be effective, cannabidiol would represent a substantial improvement over current drugs, all of which have serious side effects: One, for example, causes irrev…

This shows the derangement of the people in charge. Why is this? Why this derangement on the subject of cannabis? I've read a fair amount, and every time I've brought it up, I get downvoted to hell. So, I'll ask: Anyone have a hypothesis on why a large number of our leaders, who happen to be older white men, are insanely against this plant?

Because, combined with a police state and selective enforcement, its prohibition is an amazing tool for filling prisons with black and brown bodies.

Re: Federal chokehold on marijuana stymies studies on epilepsy, autism

#38

Post by black6 » Tue, Sep 11, 2018, 2:53 PM UTC

e40 wrote: post #32

nopacience wrote: post #27

> In March, Insys launched a multinational study of 190 children to evaluate cannabidiol as a first-line therapy for infantile spasms. We are eager to see how well the compound performs when given in the first days and weeks of the condition. If it turns out to be effective, cannabidiol would represent a substantial improvement over current drugs, all of which have serious side effects: One, for example, causes irrev…

This shows the derangement of the people in charge. Why is this? Why this derangement on the subject of cannabis? I've read a fair amount, and every time I've brought it up, I get downvoted to hell. So, I'll ask: Anyone have a hypothesis on why a large number of our leaders, who happen to be older white men, are insanely against this plant?

I dug into campaign finance when a single state representstive tabled a bill to allow on-site sales at local breweries (the rep had received >$19,000 from AB-InBev over the past 10 years) and one of the things I noticed was that EVERYONE got pharma money. Lots of it. You can say campaign contributions don’t buy votes til you’re blue in the face, and then I’ll sell you a bridge.

edit: I should clarify that medicinal herbs one can grow oneself scare the profit-hungry pharmaceutical industry, and they will (and do) spend money to keep such plants illegal. There is also money from private prison companies who earn profit on the incarceration of citizens who stand to lose money if marijuana is fully decriminalized (I’m not going to pull a number out of thin air, but I believe it is a majority of inmates who are locked up for victimless drug crimes). State and local police departments love to receive federal grants to keep on fighting the war on drugs. There is so much money and effort against the legalization of a f’ing plant, and from so many sides, that even a well-meaning politician can look at the “evidence” and believe the public, as a whole, wants to keep Mother Nature illegal.

Re: Federal chokehold on marijuana stymies studies on epilepsy, autism

#39

Post by ivl » Tue, Sep 11, 2018, 2:53 PM UTC

e40 wrote: post #32

nopacience wrote: post #27

> In March, Insys launched a multinational study of 190 children to evaluate cannabidiol as a first-line therapy for infantile spasms. We are eager to see how well the compound performs when given in the first days and weeks of the condition. If it turns out to be effective, cannabidiol would represent a substantial improvement over current drugs, all of which have serious side effects: One, for example, causes irrev…

This shows the derangement of the people in charge. Why is this? Why this derangement on the subject of cannabis? I've read a fair amount, and every time I've brought it up, I get downvoted to hell. So, I'll ask: Anyone have a hypothesis on why a large number of our leaders, who happen to be older white men, are insanely against this plant?

Because they're fearful and they have support from fearful people who want to punish drug users for no reason. Moral panics are some of the worst things in existence. Leads to absolute garbage like the Convention on Psychotropic Substances.

I'm astounded that psilocybin mushrooms, mescaline, and LSD are all scheduled so harshly.

Re: Federal chokehold on marijuana stymies studies on epilepsy, autism

#40

Post by stevenwoo » Tue, Sep 11, 2018, 2:57 PM UTC

e40 wrote: post #32

nopacience wrote: post #27

> In March, Insys launched a multinational study of 190 children to evaluate cannabidiol as a first-line therapy for infantile spasms. We are eager to see how well the compound performs when given in the first days and weeks of the condition. If it turns out to be effective, cannabidiol would represent a substantial improvement over current drugs, all of which have serious side effects: One, for example, causes irrev…

This shows the derangement of the people in charge. Why is this? Why this derangement on the subject of cannabis? I've read a fair amount, and every time I've brought it up, I get downvoted to hell. So, I'll ask: Anyone have a hypothesis on why a large number of our leaders, who happen to be older white men, are insanely against this plant?

Drug laws can be selectively enforced to give criminal records to people of color. Then the state can refuse to give people with criminal records the right to vote. There's no immediate gain for a politician to reform these laws (the people affected can't or don't vote), the other legal drugs already have huge lobbies to pay the politician, and the law and order crowd has a sizeable popularity that is hard to budge with any sort of non punitive solution until it affects them directly and personally.