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To Restore Civil Society, Start with the Library

nytimes.com

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Re: To Restore Civil Society, Start with the Library

#11

Post by detaro »

zanba38 wrote: post #10
skookumchuck wrote: post #7

I appreciate the librarians because they're one of the very few people who stand up against ubiquitous government surveillance. It's nice to have a place where I am not profiled based on what I browse.

I don't understand this comment. Are librarians politically aligned in the US? If so, why? Also, if you are going to downvote, you might as well spend some time explaining why.

Avoiding patrons from being tracked/potentially in the future prosecuted for their reading is professional ethics for librarians, pretty much regardless of political alignment.

Re: To Restore Civil Society, Start with the Library

#12

Post by zanba38 »

detaro wrote: post #11
zanba38 wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand this comment. Are librarians politically aligned in the US? If so, why? Also, if you are going to downvote, you might as well spend some time explaining why.

Avoiding patrons from being tracked/potentially in the future prosecuted for their reading is professional ethics for librarians, pretty much regardless of political alignment.

That's interesting and new to me, as I'm not American. Does the American government track or prosecute people for their reading habits in libraries? Is it to be expected then that librarians are aligned to the political left?

Re: To Restore Civil Society, Start with the Library

#13

Post by kaybe »

zanba38 wrote: post #12
detaro wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Avoiding patrons from being tracked/potentially in the future prosecuted for their reading is professional ethics for librarians, pretty much regardless of political alignment.

That's interesting and new to me, as I'm not American. Does the American government track or prosecute people for their reading habits in libraries? Is it to be expected then that librarians are aligned to the political left?

Since 2001 (at least) the law enforcement is supposed to have access to library records. The legal basis keeps changing, though.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patriot_Act

Re: To Restore Civil Society, Start with the Library

#14

Post by kasey_junk »

Mediterraneo10 wrote: post #9
interfixus wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, but it is the fault of libraries if they fail to enforce reasonable standards of behavior on the premises.

What do you expect a librarian – who is, after all, not a trained security guard – to do besides simply call the police? And in so many of the examples that I see people complain about, it would seem that the disruption by homeless people or drug users is only noticed after it has taken place (e.g. they trash the toilets or leave needles or paraphenalia behind).

Libraries can hire security (and most around me have).

It’s a sad outcome in it means less funds for library services but it’s better than libraries not being used because people feel unsafe.

Re: To Restore Civil Society, Start with the Library

#15

Post by ivansavz »

zanba38 wrote: post #10
skookumchuck wrote: post #7

I appreciate the librarians because they're one of the very few people who stand up against ubiquitous government surveillance. It's nice to have a place where I am not profiled based on what I browse.

I don't understand this comment. Are librarians politically aligned in the US? If so, why? Also, if you are going to downvote, you might as well spend some time explaining why.

I think what skookumchuck is referring to is the general notion that "privacy and confidentiality has long been an integral part of the intellectual freedom mission of libraries," see http://www.ala.org/advocacy/privacy/guidelines/library-manag...

Re: To Restore Civil Society, Start with the Library

#16

Post by detaro »

zanba38 wrote: post #12
detaro wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Avoiding patrons from being tracked/potentially in the future prosecuted for their reading is professional ethics for librarians, pretty much regardless of political alignment.

That's interesting and new to me, as I'm not American. Does the American government track or prosecute people for their reading habits in libraries? Is it to be expected then that librarians are aligned to the political left?

It could start at some point if detailed records exist. Libraries operate long-term, political climate changes. And of course other actors could be interested in records too. I don't think you can claim someone on the political right would by default not want to protect readers.

Re: To Restore Civil Society, Start with the Library

#17

Post by mynameishere »

Mediterraneo10 wrote: post #9
interfixus wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, but it is the fault of libraries if they fail to enforce reasonable standards of behavior on the premises.

What do you expect a librarian – who is, after all, not a trained security guard – to do besides simply call the police? And in so many of the examples that I see people complain about, it would seem that the disruption by homeless people or drug users is only noticed after it has taken place (e.g. they trash the toilets or leave needles or paraphenalia behind).

What an odd "problem". I would expect the librarian to call the police. And if there was a "trained security guard" on the premises I would expect him to also call the police.

(That's why we have police.)

Re: To Restore Civil Society, Start with the Library

#18

Post by tomjen3 »

zanba38 wrote: post #12
detaro wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Avoiding patrons from being tracked/potentially in the future prosecuted for their reading is professional ethics for librarians, pretty much regardless of political alignment.

That's interesting and new to me, as I'm not American. Does the American government track or prosecute people for their reading habits in libraries? Is it to be expected then that librarians are aligned to the political left?

You wouldn't, in general, be able to ban books in the US, but if it was possible to profile people based on their library records, say somebody read Das Capital, The Anarchist Cookbook and a few similar books like that and you are the police searching for an anarchist bomber?

Re: To Restore Civil Society, Start with the Library

#20

Post by eswat »

housingpost wrote: post #2

I love the idea of libraries, but where I live most of them are almost as bad as public transportation. People fighting, being loud, people on drugs asking for money, so it's difficult to get comfortable to sit and read. Sadly you have to go to the suburbs to get a quiet library where you don't get hassled. Amazon certainly isn't the solution, but neither is having libraries be the daytime homeless shelter.

Where I am in Canada, I haven’t found suburb libraries to be a safe haven either; you have bored, angst-ridden teens wanting to start fights there instead and there’s usually not as much security to stop them compared to an urban library.
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