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EU copyright reform: the facts

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Re: EU copyright reform: the facts

#21

Post by pjc50 »

jimmaswell wrote: post #6
Ygg2 wrote: post #2

Holy crap on a stick. These new laws are just stupid. I don't generally see eye to eye with libertarians (or whoever advocates for minimal interference of state), but out of touch laws like this are just the worst.

The EU and its member states have a penchant for crazy laws like this, GDPR, local movie quotas on services like Netflix, arresting people who train their dog to do a bellamy salute, arresting people for having potato peelers in public, and so on. I can't think of a single reason other than vacation days that I'd ever want to live there. I'm aware comparisons to 1984 are a cliche but the EU truly has been inching tow…

I'm assuming that "bellamy" is a weird autocorrect for "Hitler", in which case I refer to my recent comment: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17927075

The illegal act was sending the threatening message "gas the jews" through a telecommunications system.

The potato peeler incident: https://dailycaller.com/2018/05/03/british-man-arrested-for-...

Homeless man with learning difficulties wielding a knife-like object in public?

In both cases the relevant law is UK domestic criminal law, not EU law.

Re: EU copyright reform: the facts

#22

Post by Y_Y »

kmisiunas wrote: post #5

For EU people who want to take action: call or email your Member European Parliament (MEP) and let them know that don't supper the policy (or support it?!?). You can call them via: https://act.openmedia.org/savethelink-call Or email by finding your MEP details on: http://www.europarl.europa.eu/meps/en/search.html More info on taking action can br found here (scroll a little): https://juliareda.eu/eu-copyright-reform/

You can use an automated (customisable) tool at saveyourinternet.eu to do this too.

Re: EU copyright reform: the facts

#23

Post by pjc50 »

kd5bjo wrote: post #20

Is there a simple, objective summary of the proposed rules? Everything I've seen is propaganda trying to convince me they're the end of the internet, which makes me quite wary of the authors' motivations.

You can read the directive itself: https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/HTML/?uri=CEL...

Re: EU copyright reform: the facts

#24

Post by pjc50 »

no1youknowz wrote: post #13

From the viewpoint of regulations on business: - GDPR (Facebook/Google) - Article 11 (Reddit) - Article 13 (Github) - Mandated EU Content on streaming providers (Netflix) - EU Internet sales tax (Amazon) The simple question begs: how many more regulations aimed at US companies are coming? At this rate, the more regulations are created at fighting US companies. The number of internet startups and business located in t…

> EU Internet sales tax (Amazon)

This is the proposal that Amazon should pay tax where the goods are sold, rather than hiding it in Luxembourg?

Re: EU copyright reform: the facts

#25

Post by Y_Y »

no1youknowz wrote: post #13

From the viewpoint of regulations on business: - GDPR (Facebook/Google) - Article 11 (Reddit) - Article 13 (Github) - Mandated EU Content on streaming providers (Netflix) - EU Internet sales tax (Amazon) The simple question begs: how many more regulations aimed at US companies are coming? At this rate, the more regulations are created at fighting US companies. The number of internet startups and business located in t…

Well if they only cycle to zero then they'll just come back up again just as fast, so that seems not so bad.

Article 13 is hardly an attack on Github, even if it may affect them. The EU loves US money and tech, and is happy to keep it (it seems it's happy to stay too). I'm totally against this proposal, but not because of anti-regulation dogma. That's rightly unpopular in prosperous and socialist Europe.

Re: EU copyright reform: the facts

#26

Post by GekkePrutser »

vfc1 wrote: post #8

"Only a handful of the largest tech companies have the technical and financial means to operate the sprawling filtering systems that this law demands." The smaller platforms often use under the hood Amazon AWS, Google Cloud or equivalent. Probably the copyright verification is going to be added at that level, and hopefully will be transparent to the platforms built on top of those cloud services. So hopefully, this w…

This is exactly what I fear: everyone outsourcing their filtering to a handful of big companies.

These companies will then have the definitive say on what is posted online and what isn't. The Chinese will be jealous of our new censorship machine.

Re: EU copyright reform: the facts

#27

Post by raverbashing »

klmr wrote: post #19
jimmaswell wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The EU and its member states have a penchant for crazy laws like this, GDPR, local movie quotas on services like Netflix, arresting people who train their dog to do a bellamy salute, arresting people for having potato peelers in public, and so on. I can't think of a single reason other than vacation days that I'd ever want to live there. I'm aware comparisons to 1984 are a cliche but the EU truly has been inching tow…

That’s pure trolling: First off, the Article 13 in question was already rejected once by Parliament and is expected to be repealed against (but it doesn’t hurt to be cautious, good on Mozilla). > GDPR While not uncontroversial, GDPR is generally seen as a good thing by experts. > arresting people who train their dog to do a bellamy salute This didn’t happen. The man was arrested for hate speech, not for gestures his…

> First off, the Article 13 in question was already rejected once by Parliament and is expected to be repealed against (but it doesn’t hurt to be cautious, good on Mozilla).

As they say, don't count your chickens before they're hatched

Re: EU copyright reform: the facts

#28

Post by GekkePrutser »

ManlyBread wrote: post #9
esquivalience wrote: post #3

Whether or not you agree with the copyright reforms, it is not helpful to present these opinions (e.g. 'will negatively affect...') as fact. You may as well stand outside the legislative building with a placard. To my mind, it's impossible to take part in the debate until you've realised that your position is a point of view; that other have a different point of view; and that compromise is going to be necessary.

It's quite hard to talk about a compromise when there's zero benefit in accepting the new law to begin with. Remember how effective the SOPA/ACTA protests were, the only reason these succeded was because no one was interested in a compromise.

They weren't effective. The same has already been implemented through a loophole with Canada (CETA) so US companies can already force their lower standards on us through their Canadian subsidiaries.

Simple distraction and switch and playing into the mindset that Canada has somehow ties with Europe and is therefore 'good'.

It's amazing how they get away with these things.

Re: EU copyright reform: the facts

#29

Post by kd5bjo »

pjc50 wrote: post #23
kd5bjo wrote: post #20

Is there a simple, objective summary of the proposed rules? Everything I've seen is propaganda trying to convince me they're the end of the internet, which makes me quite wary of the authors' motivations.

You can read the directive itself: https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/HTML/?uri=CEL...

Yes, but with all the cross-references and legalese specifying which level of government is responsible for enforcing each piece of the directive, the actual regulations can be hard to extract for an untrained reader.

Hence my request for an objective summary.

Re: EU copyright reform: the facts

#30

Post by pjc50 »

klmr wrote: post #19
jimmaswell wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The EU and its member states have a penchant for crazy laws like this, GDPR, local movie quotas on services like Netflix, arresting people who train their dog to do a bellamy salute, arresting people for having potato peelers in public, and so on. I can't think of a single reason other than vacation days that I'd ever want to live there. I'm aware comparisons to 1984 are a cliche but the EU truly has been inching tow…

That’s pure trolling: First off, the Article 13 in question was already rejected once by Parliament and is expected to be repealed against (but it doesn’t hurt to be cautious, good on Mozilla). > GDPR While not uncontroversial, GDPR is generally seen as a good thing by experts. > arresting people who train their dog to do a bellamy salute This didn’t happen. The man was arrested for hate speech, not for gestures his…

> the UK, which is generally pretty low on violent crimes, has a specific problem with knife crimes and is therefore tackling the problem heads-on.

Sadly neither the problem nor the solution is new - the ban on knives in public dates to at least 1953.

It's interesting (and very Brexity) that people blame these things on the EU when they're both very much British criminal law independent of the EU.

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