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Tesla Accounting Chief, HR Head Resign on the Same Day; Stock Plunges

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Re: Tesla Accounting Chief, HR Head Resign on the Same Day; Stock Plunges

#61

Post by deusofnull »

covercash wrote: post #13
chollida1 wrote: post #3

And their Chief People Officer, is not coming back from her leave. From the outside it looks like Telsa is about going to go into a tough winter like moment. They are almost losing by winning. They are at capacity in their Fremont factory but still not making a profit. They need to start designing and building out manufacturing facilities for their next car and the help bolster Model X manufacturing. Stop and think f…

Maybe that’s his backup plan if it doesn’t work out... use a BoringCo drill to “accidentally” trigger an earthquake, collect insurance money, funnel it all into SpaceX and launch himself to Mars.

Maybe he's gonna use a BoringCompany drill to DRILL to Mars. Ever think of that?

Re: Tesla Accounting Chief, HR Head Resign on the Same Day; Stock Plunges

#62

Post by maxxxxx »

I just watched a part of the Joe Rogan podcast with Musk and I have to say he looks very unhealthy. Maybe I am wrong but to me he looks like he is drinking a lot or on some other drugs.

I can imagine working with a CEO who is pushing himself way other the limit is a pretty unpleasant experience.

Re: Tesla Accounting Chief, HR Head Resign on the Same Day; Stock Plunges

#63

Post by ModernMech »

api wrote: post #39
toomuchtodo wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> After that he had a range of little annoying problems, many of which were likely software bugs, but then he (actually his GF) experienced something in autopilot mode known on the Tesla forums as "shadow braking" -- the car braking hard on the highway because it seems to see the shadow of an overpass and think it's a wall. This is extremely dangerous. It was on the I-405 (SoCal) going 70-80mph, and such a thing coul…

Hard braking at 80mph isn't as dangerous as not seeing a tractor trailer, but it could definitely cause a serious accident. I'm starting to understand why all the other self-drive companies use active sensors like lidar. You need that to compensate for the fact that the AI actually driving the car is less intelligent than a honeybee. A self-drive "AI" is dumb. It's just a glorified expert system with a lot of pattern…

> I'm starting to understand why all the other self-drive companies use active sensors like lidar.

Every roboticist since the DARPA Grand Challenge knew this, as every team that finished had a Velodyne LIDAR. It was THE piece of tech that made that race possible. So for everyone who learned that lesson, to then see Telsas out on public roads with a feature called "autopilot" that did not have any LIDAR sensor attached to it... well... Let's just say we've been saying "I told you so" since then.

Re: Tesla Accounting Chief, HR Head Resign on the Same Day; Stock Plunges

#64

Post by velcrovan »

sophistication wrote: post #16

I'm not losing optimism because of this. Musk fits right into the current political & cultural trajectory and the Tesla brand is sleek & timeless. The media is framing Musk's flaws (Twitter insults, weed & booze) as a bad thing, but outside of the media, people do not care about such things nearly as much. It just requires a few years of optimization and the cars are going to be en par with established brands.

You're right that Musk does not need to score political points with the everyday person in order for Tesla to succeed.

But by the same token, Musk's "fitting into the current political and cultural trajectory" (whatever that means) is also of no value to Tesla.

The actual concerns people have are much more concrete.

Tesla has already had "a few years of optimization". They have been making cars for ten years now. They are still burning bales of cash. They have consistently failed, by large margins, to deliver on production targets. Major competitors who DO have a consistent history of large-scale production are coming out with comparable products that will actually be possible to buy without waiting in line for two years.

Their accounting chief quitting after a month only adds to the pile. Anyone who has been in management at a failing concern knows the numbers people are the canaries in the coal mine. No, it's not a guarantee they will fail, but only an inexperienced person would ignore it.

Re: Tesla Accounting Chief, HR Head Resign on the Same Day; Stock Plunges

#65

Post by rcMgD2BwE72F »

scottkduncan wrote: post #47
rcMgD2BwE72F wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Management said they don't need to raise funds to cover the capex needed to ramp up Model 3 sales to 7/week, which is (as confirmed multiple times by Musk) more than needed to turn a profit. They just need to turn a profit in Q3 to get the stock price back up and then, they might raise funds to finance the next products (Model Y, truck and Semi). Why raise funds when Wall Street bet on the company to go bankrupt? Rai…

"Wall Street" is not betting on them to go bankrupt. Collectively, investors value this company that produces, at best, 7K cars a week at $45 billion. The idea that one quarter of profitability achieved through slashing capex to the bone fundamentally would fundamentally change their valuation doesn't carry much water in my view.

>Collectively, investors value this company (...)

Most large investors are just holding. The small amount of shares that are exchanged every day are bought/sold by speculators and they are backed by institutions that get paid for this intraday activity. Also, with all the short positions on TSLA, the bank are risking an almost infinite sum of money (in case of a short squeeze).

Since Tesla doesn't intend to raise capital for the foreseeable future, banks can only gain from volatility or from a major event that would force Tesla to raise funds.

Re: Tesla Accounting Chief, HR Head Resign on the Same Day; Stock Plunges

#66

Post by nickik »

Filligree wrote: post #4

A while ago I considered reserving a model 3, but I eventually decided against it. Feel like I dodged a bullet, there. There was a time where Tesla had a genuine advantage over the incumbents, but it never was enough of an advantage to overcome their lack of experience. That's only obvious in retrospect, I suppose.

Can I as you what you are basing this on?

Tesla has more experience in terms of electronics, batteries, electronic drive train and software. They might not be as good in terms of building car frames but they basically figured it out and the M3 is not a mass production car.

It seems to me its the other car companies who are missing core experience on many of the core technologies needed for the future.

Re: Tesla Accounting Chief, HR Head Resign on the Same Day; Stock Plunges

#67

Post by toomuchtodo »

ModernMech wrote: post #63
api wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hard braking at 80mph isn't as dangerous as not seeing a tractor trailer, but it could definitely cause a serious accident. I'm starting to understand why all the other self-drive companies use active sensors like lidar. You need that to compensate for the fact that the AI actually driving the car is less intelligent than a honeybee. A self-drive "AI" is dumb. It's just a glorified expert system with a lot of pattern…

> I'm starting to understand why all the other self-drive companies use active sensors like lidar. Every roboticist since the DARPA Grand Challenge knew this, as every team that finished had a Velodyne LIDAR. It was THE piece of tech that made that race possible. So for everyone who learned that lesson, to then see Telsas out on public roads with a feature called "autopilot" that did not have any LIDAR sensor attache…

I think it's a little early for people who don't "do" to call it that LIDAR is mandatory, and that optics and radar aren't sufficient. Autopilot is still in development.

Re: Tesla Accounting Chief, HR Head Resign on the Same Day; Stock Plunges

#68

Post by Nokinside »

sophistication wrote: post #16

I'm not losing optimism because of this. Musk fits right into the current political & cultural trajectory and the Tesla brand is sleek & timeless. The media is framing Musk's flaws (Twitter insults, weed & booze) as a bad thing, but outside of the media, people do not care about such things nearly as much. It just requires a few years of optimization and the cars are going to be en par with established brands.

He is bipolar and it's going to end with tragedy if it's not addressed.

Re: Tesla Accounting Chief, HR Head Resign on the Same Day; Stock Plunges

#69

Post by Retric »

scottkduncan wrote: post #47
rcMgD2BwE72F wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Management said they don't need to raise funds to cover the capex needed to ramp up Model 3 sales to 7/week, which is (as confirmed multiple times by Musk) more than needed to turn a profit. They just need to turn a profit in Q3 to get the stock price back up and then, they might raise funds to finance the next products (Model Y, truck and Semi). Why raise funds when Wall Street bet on the company to go bankrupt? Rai…

"Wall Street" is not betting on them to go bankrupt. Collectively, investors value this company that produces, at best, 7K cars a week at $45 billion. The idea that one quarter of profitability achieved through slashing capex to the bone fundamentally would fundamentally change their valuation doesn't carry much water in my view.

Tesla is more than just a car manufacture. I doubt self driving + solar + battery + charging network etc is worth the kind premium they have over just being a car company.

But, analysis based strictly on car sales a mistake, especially as established car companies outsource so much parts production.

Re: Tesla Accounting Chief, HR Head Resign on the Same Day; Stock Plunges

#70

Post by nickik »

empath75 wrote: post #7

IMO, they should fire musk, slow down their blue-sky research projects, rip autopilot out of the cars, and just build "boring" luxury electric cars with huge profit margins and rake in cash.

I have not clue how you get to that conclusion.

I simply don't get it. Elon is incredibly successful and he did many things nobody believed would happen and he keeped the business alive against all odds in situation way worse then things are now.

Rip out autopilot? What, why the fuck would the do that? The autopilot works well and 10000s of people (at least) are using it every day and it provides them the base of data to improve their capability in this vital future business.

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