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Wikimedia warns EU copyright reform threatens the ‘vibrant free web’

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Re: Wikimedia warns EU copyright reform threatens the ‘vibrant free web’

#121

Post by bahamut1928 »

anoifeh wrote: post #112
bahamut1928 wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please understand that for many of us in the EU, freedom of speech as understood and implemented by Americans is not something desirable. Based solely on my personal experience, most of the people are actually happy on how censorship is handled by our institutions. I've never felt restricted in expressing my opinion in whichever topic we are discussing, and I am actually happy that people preaching racist ideologies…

>I've never felt restricted in expressing my opinion in whichever topic we are discussing Of course, if you belong to a mainstream ideology...

In some cases I do, in others I don't. I've never encounter censorship in either of those. Besides, I had some pretty interesting discussions with people expressing ideas which did not agree with my thoughts. If, as you said, I would be on the "mainstream" side, they would have been censored. That did not happen.

Re: Wikimedia warns EU copyright reform threatens the ‘vibrant free web’

#122

Post by kruczek »

friedman23 wrote: post #54
HeadsUpHigh wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Why should foreign companies have to comply with these policies anyway? Because they want revenue from EU citizens? Should a car company from China have to comply to US safety regulations when selling cars to US citizens? >GDPR compliance has already had a negative impact on web UX. Nah. I've switched off tracking on every website I use often via the popups and I've noticed much faster loading. Imo GDPR has made the…

> Because they want revenue from EU citizens? First of all not all websites make money. Secondly, monetizing the EU is a step that usually occurs very late into the life of a startup. Startups almost always monetize the US first. So if you are a company that owns a website that doesn't make money from the EU and the EU comes up with regulations that adds thousands of dollars in costs and hundreds of thousands of doll…

> First of all not all websites make money.

If they don't make money, then why would they need to collect and share data about their users? If they don't collect and share, then they don't need to make any privacy notifications, so it doesn't impact UX.

Re: Wikimedia warns EU copyright reform threatens the ‘vibrant free web’

#123

Post by kruczek »

openbasic wrote: post #39
suckerburg wrote: post #35

EU builds a good reputation after setting a good standard with GDPR, some politicians started talking about copying it which made me happy. Now I'm scared again wondering what would happen if they go through with this and politicians everywhere start copying it.

Good reputation for what? Government interference in the free web? GDPR was just the first step. Open your eyes.

Government interference which requires websites to inform users about collected data, therefore improving freedom of those users by giving them control over their data.

Re: Wikimedia warns EU copyright reform threatens the ‘vibrant free web’

#124

Post by qubax »

bahamut1928 wrote: post #86
qubax wrote: post #32

What's with all the comments supporting censorship all of sudden? Every social media site now has hordes of "people" defending censorship. Is it just more european users on social media now? Or is it just government funded trolling? I just don't get it. Saudi arabia just declared online satire as a cybercrime punishable up to 5 years in prison. https://www.france24.com/en/20180904-saudi-arabia-declares-o... We know h…

Please understand that for many of us in the EU, freedom of speech as understood and implemented by Americans is not something desirable. Based solely on my personal experience, most of the people are actually happy on how censorship is handled by our institutions. I've never felt restricted in expressing my opinion in whichever topic we are discussing, and I am actually happy that people preaching racist ideologies…

[flagged]

Re: Wikimedia warns EU copyright reform threatens the ‘vibrant free web’

#125

Post by runeks »

point78 wrote: post #52
nnash wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Should a car company from China have to comply to US safety regulations when selling cars to US citizens? In your example, the car company is implicitly selling to a foreign country. When it comes to software/websites, a user from a foreign country is incidentally served rather than implicitly.

The websites are profiting off the visitors no matter what country they're in. If they don't want to follow the laws then block the country.

So everyone who hosts a website has the obligation to read up on the legality of that particular website for all countries in the world, and block accordingly?

That doesn’t seem reasonable to me.

Re: Wikimedia warns EU copyright reform threatens the ‘vibrant free web’

#126

Post by friedman23 »

kruczek wrote: post #122
friedman23 wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Because they want revenue from EU citizens? First of all not all websites make money. Secondly, monetizing the EU is a step that usually occurs very late into the life of a startup. Startups almost always monetize the US first. So if you are a company that owns a website that doesn't make money from the EU and the EU comes up with regulations that adds thousands of dollars in costs and hundreds of thousands of doll…

> First of all not all websites make money. If they don't make money, then why would they need to collect and share data about their users? If they don't collect and share, then they don't need to make any privacy notifications, so it doesn't impact UX.

> If they don't make money, then why would they need to collect and share data about their users?

If you've ever developed a website you should absolutely know why you might need to collect and share data. Google analytics is considered sharing btw.

Re: Wikimedia warns EU copyright reform threatens the ‘vibrant free web’

#127

Post by kruczek »

friedman23 wrote: post #126
kruczek wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> First of all not all websites make money. If they don't make money, then why would they need to collect and share data about their users? If they don't collect and share, then they don't need to make any privacy notifications, so it doesn't impact UX.

> If they don't make money, then why would they need to collect and share data about their users? If you've ever developed a website you should absolutely know why you might need to collect and share data. Google analytics is considered sharing btw.

Perhaps I wasn't explicit, but by data I mean personal data, which is what GDPR is all about. While the desire to collect general statistics about site usage is obvious, I still do not see any reason to collect personal data.

Re: Wikimedia warns EU copyright reform threatens the ‘vibrant free web’

#128

Post by tincholio »

intended wrote: post #113
tincholio wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Packet sniffing was created for the AAs I'm pretty sure tcpdump predates Napster and any involvement of the AAs in the workings of the Internet...

Nope - as I recall that was the ISPs defense “we don’t know what people are sharing since we can’t look into packets”

The first version of tcpdump dates from '88[0]. And I'm not sure it was even the first sniffer out there, quite likely not.

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tcpdump

Re: Wikimedia warns EU copyright reform threatens the ‘vibrant free web’

#129

Post by bahamut1928 »

qubax wrote: post #124
bahamut1928 wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please understand that for many of us in the EU, freedom of speech as understood and implemented by Americans is not something desirable. Based solely on my personal experience, most of the people are actually happy on how censorship is handled by our institutions. I've never felt restricted in expressing my opinion in whichever topic we are discussing, and I am actually happy that people preaching racist ideologies…

[flagged]

> The difference between the US and Europe is that US loves freedom and europe doesn't This is absurd. Every country, including the US, has some restrictions. The fact that we put the boundaries in a different place doesn't mean that we don't love our freedom.

>Isn't the fact that we didn't have a nazi germany, soviet union or a fascist italy proof enough? No, it is not. Other countries in Europe following similar censorship policies have not experienced such regimes. Besides, although there is a strong relation between those regimes and censorship, there were plenty of others things happening that makes you wonder if things would not have happened anyway even with American free speech.

Your line of reasoning can be applied to attribute several of the historical and recent problems in the USA to your execution of free speech. Furthermore, even in the USA you have restrictions when voicing your opinion, just like in Europe.

Re: Wikimedia warns EU copyright reform threatens the ‘vibrant free web’

#130

Post by point78 »

runeks wrote: post #125
point78 wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The websites are profiting off the visitors no matter what country they're in. If they don't want to follow the laws then block the country.

So everyone who hosts a website has the obligation to read up on the legality of that particular website for all countries in the world, and block accordingly? That doesn’t seem reasonable to me.

Uh...yes? You think you can just open a business in country x, break their laws, then shrug your shoulders and say "Well it's legal where I'm from"
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