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Electric Vehicles’ Day Will Come, and It Might Come Suddenly

bloomberg.com

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Re: Electric Vehicles’ Day Will Come, and It Might Come Suddenly

#261

Post by rypskar »

gnicholas wrote: post #247
Marsymars wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would someone buy an electric car if they had to pay the equivalent price of gas to charge it?

I bought a used C-MAX plug-in hybrid and was told that with the EV plan offered by PG&E, I'd save money versus gas. Only after I purchased did I learn that the EV plan gives you cheaper charging at night only if you're willing to stomach very high rates during the day. Since I work from home a lot and have a toddler, this is a non-starter for my family. So we pay roughly the same amount per mile with electricity as f…

>in CA, where gas is expensive

That actually made me laugh. It might cost more than in other US states, but is almost free comparing to most of Europe [1]. Average size of cars and engines, larger car with larger engine use more gas, also tell a lot of price compared to income, and it you compare traffic in Europe and America you will also see that Americans pay way to little for gas

[1]https://www.statista.com/statistics/221368/gas-prices-around...

Re: Electric Vehicles’ Day Will Come, and It Might Come Suddenly

#262

Post by jacquesm »

baxtr wrote: post #237
zizee wrote: post #45

I think that electric car adoption is going to have similar characteristics to digital cameras. I remember playing with an early digital camera and seeing a poor replacement for film, but with obvious benefits. Back then it was common to hear "serious" photographers pooh-poohing digital, and how it's many drawbacks would mean it would remain niche, and never replace film. It didn't take long and digial cameras improv…

The one thing that is really different is that digital cameras didn’t required a huge network of infrastructure to succeed. That’s unfortunately where you’re analogy breaks down

Actually, they did. Film manufacture, distribution and developing.

Re: Electric Vehicles’ Day Will Come, and It Might Come Suddenly

#263

Post by xedeon »

Tuxer wrote: post #196
whatever1 wrote: post #188

Try to sell a 5 year old vehicle of let’s say 35k original price when it needs an $10k repair to get a new battery and dump the half tone of environmentally friendly junk. More importantly, convince the truck drivers with 150k miles per year that they will have to dispose their truck ever 2-3 years (1000 charges). Electric vehicles will take over when a battery breakthrough occurs, one that affects recharge time, wei…

The first model Ss that have hit 10 years and 200k miles have shown an average of 3% battery capacity decrease. Car batteries aren't phone batteries :)

400K miles actually!

https://electrek.co/2018/07/17/tesla-model-s-holds-up-400000...

Re: Electric Vehicles’ Day Will Come, and It Might Come Suddenly

#264

Post by baxtr »

jacquesm wrote: post #262
baxtr wrote: post #237

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The one thing that is really different is that digital cameras didn’t required a huge network of infrastructure to succeed. That’s unfortunately where you’re analogy breaks down

Actually, they did. Film manufacture, distribution and developing.

Sorry I don’t understand. Digital cameras require film manufacturing, distribution and developing?

Re: Electric Vehicles’ Day Will Come, and It Might Come Suddenly

#265

Post by some_account »

baxtr wrote: post #237
zizee wrote: post #45

I think that electric car adoption is going to have similar characteristics to digital cameras. I remember playing with an early digital camera and seeing a poor replacement for film, but with obvious benefits. Back then it was common to hear "serious" photographers pooh-poohing digital, and how it's many drawbacks would mean it would remain niche, and never replace film. It didn't take long and digial cameras improv…

The one thing that is really different is that digital cameras didn’t required a huge network of infrastructure to succeed. That’s unfortunately where you’re analogy breaks down

We are supposed to stay on oil because we can't build infrastructure? Humans... Are we the dumbest species or what?

Re: Electric Vehicles’ Day Will Come, and It Might Come Suddenly

#266

Post by tormeh »

xorfish wrote: post #258
tormeh wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think so. A car is the most outwardly visible status/everything symbol you have. This is important, especially for men without a family. They're not going to want to be seen in a Renault Zoe or a scooter.

A Tesla isn't a status symbol?

It is. A Renault Zoe or a scooter is not.

Re: Electric Vehicles’ Day Will Come, and It Might Come Suddenly

#267

Post by jacquesm »

GW150914 wrote: post #254
sam_goody wrote: post #235

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Out where I live, the electric bike is as common as a regular bike. When I first saw one, people said it was a useless half measure - if you don't want to peddle, you would take the car. The has proven wrong, and as time goes by, the reverse happens - it replaces the car. You should realize that many people who buy these scooters and electric bikes are doing so to replace the bike, not the car. But then over time it…

Electric bikes are a huge improvement over standard bikes, and no improvement at all over a car for a significant number of use cases. They’re also no more useful than a bike in places where roads are poorly maintained, rain and snow are frequent, or no bike lanes exist. They’re not useful for taking kids to school, or doing significant errands. They are amazing for a single person to get around cheaply without killi…

> They’re not useful for taking kids to school,

Where I live a few hundred thousand kids are taken to school by bike every day. All the way up to age 10 or so it's pretty common to see parents with kids on the back (and sometimes on the front or both) of their bikes.

https://www.24baby.nl/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/mamafiets.j...

Re: Electric Vehicles’ Day Will Come, and It Might Come Suddenly

#268

Post by metafunctor »

fh973 wrote: post #202
zizee wrote: post #45

I think that electric car adoption is going to have similar characteristics to digital cameras. I remember playing with an early digital camera and seeing a poor replacement for film, but with obvious benefits. Back then it was common to hear "serious" photographers pooh-poohing digital, and how it's many drawbacks would mean it would remain niche, and never replace film. It didn't take long and digial cameras improv…

Serious question: what are the "obvious benefits" (from the consumer perspective)? I can just think of insane acceleration (which is irrelevant for actual use).

Here are a few obvious benefits off the top of my head:

* No local emissions from burning fuel.

* Noise greatly reduced.

* Much less energy consumed (and CO2 generated) per mile overall.

* The car is always topped up when I leave to work in the morning.

* Great driving experience; instant silent torque is very convenient, and hard to give up once you've gotten used to it.

* More space left for cargo.

* Middle seat in the back has actual leg room.

Re: Electric Vehicles’ Day Will Come, and It Might Come Suddenly

#269

Post by jacquesm »

usaar333 wrote: post #236
soperj wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The do in the Netherlands. Almost all school age kids were going to school together when I was there.

ah, what is the earliest age a kid will travel without adult supervision in the Netherlands?

6 or so for small distances, and without crossing major roads.

Re: Electric Vehicles’ Day Will Come, and It Might Come Suddenly

#270

Post by jacquesm »

MBCook wrote: post #150
stellar678 wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, if you say so. Clearly your opinion about people's travel has a lot more validity than the research conducted by the American (err, United States) Federal Highway Administration.

It doesn’t matter if it’s a 5 mile trip. What if three of that’s on the highway? Is that little electric scooter going to do 70 safely with all the SUVs around weaving in and out? Without me getting squashed? And when it’s snowing heavily? And maybe there’s already a foot on the ground, plus a whole bunch of ice? You think a lot of people are going to want to do their 5 miles then? Being on a motorcycle is pretty dan…

5 mile trips with three of those on the highway typically have alternatives with all 5 off the highway.
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