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How America Killed Transit

citylab.com

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Re: How America Killed Transit

#41

Post by etiennemarcel »

cryptonector wrote: post #17

The public transit system used to be privately owned and operated. Then the cities took over and kicked out the private sector. Now we have terrible public transit. Yes, even the subways in NYC were built and operated by private companies (there were two, and they competed).

That's a very American point of view.

Here in Paris, public transit is run by the state since the war and works really well. It's going to be open to private concessions in a few years (buses first, subway in 20 or 30 years) because of European regulations, I'm not sure it will change for the better...

Re: How America Killed Transit

#42

Post by CalRobert »

cryptozeus wrote: post #32

Bay area public transport is the worst. Forgot about quality, it does not even reach everywhere. Bart is not even safe, I can’t believe I miss subway

"not even reach everywhere"

This is the fault of building where there isn't transit. Not the fault of transit. Do we complain that municipal water doesn't go "everywhere" because some people build wells?

Re: How America Killed Transit

#43

Post by bobthepanda »

njarboe wrote: post #35
bobthepanda wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Problem is that point to point is not scalable. Automated platoons only work in highway settings, not in urban areas where pedestrians and cyclists need to cross traffic at regular intervals very frequently. (The American experience shows that even erecting large physical barriers to crossing roads does not work.) And you can't build more roads to get out of this mess, because we have tried and tried and tried and ev…

You can scale with tunnels. I also suggested congestion pricing in my last paragraph. Having congestion pricing on highways is also a good idea because it can reveal the price people are willing to pay for uncongested travel. That gives people an idea on how much a tunnel could make and motivate spending money on building it.

Tunnels right now are way too expensive per lane mile. And you also need interchanges to connect surface with tunnels, which runs into the same space issues that exist above ground.

Yes, the Boring Company is suggesting we can somehow solve this expensive tunnel problem with sleds for cars and vertical elevators, but those are all proof of concepts, and in any case they would probably be less reliable than current infrastructure due to the addition of more moving parts.

Re: How America Killed Transit

#44

Post by adrianN »

CamperBob2 wrote: post #34
adrianN wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is real estate around train stations more expensive if that's a place where people don't want to be? Maybe you should look at places where public transport works before claiming such nonsense.

Do you want to spend the rest of your life living next to a train station, and the rest of your career working next to a different one? Didn't think so.

I'd like to move closer to a train station, yes, but rent there is too expensive for my taste. Currently I have to walk 15 minutes to get to the nearest train station, or take the bus. I already work next to a train station. I only use the trains when the weather is really bad though, because I'm a little bit faster on my bike and I like the exercise.

I honestly don't understand your point. What's so bad about living next to a train station? There are all kinds of shops there and the trains take me to basically anywhere in the city in less than 40 minutes. Would you rather live next to a highway?

Re: How America Killed Transit

#45

Post by CamperBob2 »

adrianN wrote: post #44
CamperBob2 wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you want to spend the rest of your life living next to a train station, and the rest of your career working next to a different one? Didn't think so.

I'd like to move closer to a train station, yes, but rent there is too expensive for my taste. Currently I have to walk 15 minutes to get to the nearest train station, or take the bus. I already work next to a train station. I only use the trains when the weather is really bad though, because I'm a little bit faster on my bike and I like the exercise. I honestly don't understand your point. What's so bad about living…

Everyone can live near a road, if they wish to do so, and most people do.

Not everyone can live near a train station.

Seems like this should be obvious, but...

Re: How America Killed Transit

#46

Post by [deleted] »

etiennemarcel wrote: post #41
cryptonector wrote: post #17

The public transit system used to be privately owned and operated. Then the cities took over and kicked out the private sector. Now we have terrible public transit. Yes, even the subways in NYC were built and operated by private companies (there were two, and they competed).

That's a very American point of view. Here in Paris, public transit is run by the state since the war and works really well. It's going to be open to private concessions in a few years (buses first, subway in 20 or 30 years) because of European regulations, I'm not sure it will change for the better...

[deleted]

Re: How America Killed Transit

#47

Post by dnautics »

adrianN wrote: post #30
cryptonector wrote: post #17

The public transit system used to be privately owned and operated. Then the cities took over and kicked out the private sector. Now we have terrible public transit. Yes, even the subways in NYC were built and operated by private companies (there were two, and they competed).

Public transit, like most infrastructure, shouldn't be privatized imho. We don't want infrastructure that serves only those who can pay. I'm perfectly fine with a public transit system that needs subsidies. We heavily subsidize cars by providing cheap or free parking in cities, why not public transport?

Singapore has privatized transit. Quality of service is exceptionally high and it's one of the cheapest rail services in the world, precisely because the economic pressure encourages the lines to favor QOS and volume.

Re: How America Killed Transit

#49

Post by edaemon »

kgermino wrote: post #7
gok wrote: post #5

That comparison to Toronto is absurd. It’s a metro area with many times the population and density of the other cities listed. And what the hell is this? “Below is a set of maps that show the present-day network rail and bus lines operating at least every 30 minutes, all day to midnight, seven days a week” This effectively excludes every bus line, because there is no reason for bus lines to run the same route all day…

>This effectively excludes every bus line, because there is no reason for bus lines to run the same route all day long. This is one of the major advantages of buses. I can't think of a single bus line in my city that actually changes it's route throughout the day. Sure there's some that don't go as far into the suburbs after a certain time, but the part in the city would still qualify as "all day" by that definition.…

GP doesn't mean that some bus lines change routes. In American cities most bus routes stop running or run less frequently as it gets later in the day. This article is excluding any that stop or become less frequent before midnight.

Re: How America Killed Transit

#50

Post by jmiserez »

dnautics wrote: post #47
adrianN wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Public transit, like most infrastructure, shouldn't be privatized imho. We don't want infrastructure that serves only those who can pay. I'm perfectly fine with a public transit system that needs subsidies. We heavily subsidize cars by providing cheap or free parking in cities, why not public transport?

Singapore has privatized transit. Quality of service is exceptionally high and it's one of the cheapest rail services in the world, precisely because the economic pressure encourages the lines to favor QOS and volume.

The MRT and LRT are owned by the Land Transport Authority, Ministry of Transport, i.e. the government. What transit are you referring to?
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