Trump Accuses Google of Burying Conservative News in Search Results • Hacker News Board

Re: Trump Accuses Google of Burying Conservative News in Search Results

#101

Post by pizzazzaro » Wed, Aug 29, 2018, 3:23 PM UTC

Dwolb wrote: post #18

Yikes this is a complex topic. There’s a couple of things at play: Google does control (unbiased or biased) a significant portion of what internet users see This control has the potential to sway public opinion, direct discourse, and economically make or break businesses (even those that extend beyond media) Personally I believe gigantic internet companies like Google require more regulation because they can’t be tru…

I would just like to add some context:

Alex Jones is advising Trump about this very topic.

https://www.newsy.com/stories/infowars-alex-jones-says-he-s-...

Relevant:

Trump's Razor - the heuristic of discerning the most likely scenario by discerning the stupidest possible option.

Re: Trump Accuses Google of Burying Conservative News in Search Results

#102

Post by FilterSweep » Wed, Aug 29, 2018, 3:25 PM UTC

yostrovs wrote: post #10

Try searching for "American inventors" or "American scientists" on Google and tell me if you notice anything odd.

If you were to take Google’s “organic results” to heart this would be largely explained by the greater number of people (from all political slants) seeking out AA inventors for the sake of their online disputes.

Furthermore, to be honest, this “organic” search has largely been used to debunk racist claims. And the search has been used for over a decade.

Re: Trump Accuses Google of Burying Conservative News in Search Results

#103

Post by mindcrime » Wed, Aug 29, 2018, 4:45 PM UTC

danjoc wrote: post #86

mindcrime wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do not believe Silicon Valley has shown thoughtfulness and care for the republic in a way that I would trust them to enact this regulation. I trust Silicon Valley a hell of a lot more than I trust our government...

>I trust Silicon Valley a hell of a lot more than I trust our government... The non-poaching agreements make me disagree with you.

Fair enough. Just to be clear, I'm not saying I trust either of them very much.

Re: Trump Accuses Google of Burying Conservative News in Search Results

#104

Post by fivefive55 » Wed, Aug 29, 2018, 5:59 PM UTC

lotu wrote: post #92

jocs_ wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google has created ridiculous conditions where there is a massive arms race to be on that first result page on any give subject. The truth is Google results should not exist for anything and everthing. Especially ambiguous subjects. Who does anyone think wins these arms races that are being set up? It is as retarded as having the supreme court pumping out decisions in real time. Why does that not happen? The tech exi…

Are you literally suggesting that for some of the most important queries that people make Google should just return no results because it is too hard to decide who is on top?

I think he was. Honestly the comment doesn't make much sense when you think about it for a second. He seems to think having ready access to information you want to find is a bad thing.

Re: Trump Accuses Google of Burying Conservative News in Search Results

#105

Post by reversecs » Wed, Aug 29, 2018, 6:52 PM UTC

mullingitover wrote: post #83

So what. Google should be able to blacklist every conservative (or liberal) site if they feel like it. They're a private business, and we have a Constitution that prohibits would-be tyrants from interfering with free speech. Trump should be run out of town on a rail for even hinting that he'd like to undermine freedom of speech.

It's complex because if a single corporation has a monopoly on all the news, a single company can filter all speech. There are alternatives currently but it doesn't make it less of a monopoly.

Re: Trump Accuses Google of Burying Conservative News in Search Results

#106

Post by mullingitover » Wed, Aug 29, 2018, 11:33 PM UTC

reversecs wrote: post #105

mullingitover wrote: post #83

So what. Google should be able to blacklist every conservative (or liberal) site if they feel like it. They're a private business, and we have a Constitution that prohibits would-be tyrants from interfering with free speech. Trump should be run out of town on a rail for even hinting that he'd like to undermine freedom of speech.

It's complex because if a single corporation has a monopoly on all the news, a single company can filter all speech. There are alternatives currently but it doesn't make it less of a monopoly.

This is really simple, however: Google does not have a monopoly on news.

Re: Trump Accuses Google of Burying Conservative News in Search Results

#107

Post by reversecs » Thu, Aug 30, 2018, 3:30 AM UTC

mullingitover wrote: post #106

reversecs wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's complex because if a single corporation has a monopoly on all the news, a single company can filter all speech. There are alternatives currently but it doesn't make it less of a monopoly.

This is really simple, however: Google does not have a monopoly on news.

Maybe not about news, but what about content provided at search, and videos. Youtube and google search. Everything else is dwarfed by Google in that sense.

Re: Trump Accuses Google of Burying Conservative News in Search Results

#108

Post by repolfx » Thu, Aug 30, 2018, 8:36 AM UTC

michaelmrose wrote: post #50

repolfx wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think that would help. The UK has such a regulation still, for TV broadcasters only. It also has the BBC which is committed to such fairness and neutrality in its charter. In practice it is not enforced. For example the senior management of Channel 4 news have routinely made tweets that indicate they hate the Conservative party. And I mean really hate. Their head of output retweeted a message that said, "Writ…

Even if news programs report the news in an unbiased fashion people are bound to have personal opinions and express them on their own time. In response to "Writing from America & I can assure you that conservatives will absolutely keep needed medicine out of the hands of those who require it, if you let them" Wouldn't it be a greater crime to ignore this? It seems as if the only reason you don't want a fairness doctr…

I'm not sure what you're getting at there to be honest, especially not with the last comment about peasants? I don't want a fairness doctrine because it clearly is pointless and wouldn't be enforced, thus making it at best a waste of legislative time and at worst a selectively enforced rule; the classic weapon of tyrants everywhere.

In theory journalists should be able to separate their personal opinions from their work. Many other professions do, most notably defence lawyers. You sound like you don't believe it's possible, which should put you in agreement with me that a fairness doctrine is a silly thing to have.

As for your final comments: do you really believe conservatives - all those hundreds of millions of them around the world - are Disney villains who hate the sick and will block medicine shipments just for the sheer hell of it? That quote is obviously extremist nonsense. People refuse to sell each other medicine all the time for all sorts of reasons but it's never to do with just a blind hatred of the sick, as that quote implies. The fact that the head of a major news operation apparently believes such a statement is worthy of being repeated says everything one needs to know about the state of modern journalism.

Re: Trump Accuses Google of Burying Conservative News in Search Results

#109

Post by Fjolsvith » Thu, Aug 30, 2018, 1:43 PM UTC

jocs_ wrote: post #64

Dwolb wrote: post #18

Yikes this is a complex topic. There’s a couple of things at play: Google does control (unbiased or biased) a significant portion of what internet users see This control has the potential to sway public opinion, direct discourse, and economically make or break businesses (even those that extend beyond media) Personally I believe gigantic internet companies like Google require more regulation because they can’t be tru…

Google has created ridiculous conditions where there is a massive arms race to be on that first result page on any give subject. The truth is Google results should not exist for anything and everthing. Especially ambiguous subjects. Who does anyone think wins these arms races that are being set up? It is as retarded as having the supreme court pumping out decisions in real time. Why does that not happen? The tech exi…

Actually, there is a nice method by which anyone can have their "result" on the first page of a searcher. It's called a bidding war, and it out performs any SEO tweaking out there.

Re: Trump Accuses Google of Burying Conservative News in Search Results

#110

Post by Fjolsvith » Thu, Aug 30, 2018, 1:45 PM UTC

fivefive55 wrote: post #104

lotu wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you literally suggesting that for some of the most important queries that people make Google should just return no results because it is too hard to decide who is on top?

I think he was. Honestly the comment doesn't make much sense when you think about it for a second. He seems to think having ready access to information you want to find is a bad thing.

This sounds like something the Chinese government would espouse.