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China Has Withheld Samples of a Dangerous Flu Virus

nytimes.com

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Re: China Has Withheld Samples of a Dangerous Flu Virus

#21

Post by vedtopkar »

tomkinstinch wrote: post #13

They may be withholding physical samples, but some sequence data appears to have been released[1(eight segments of the virus from one patient),2(sequences from the last ten years)]. Sequence data like this is helpful for genomic epidemiology—modeling how the virus evolves over time and across geographic regions, as well as for investigating the potential functional impact of mutations. 1. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov…

It should be noted that the influenza virus has 8 segments, so those 8 released segments from a patient represent the entire flu genome.

Re: China Has Withheld Samples of a Dangerous Flu Virus

#22

Post by SolarNet »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #15
rrggrr wrote: post #11

An argument can be made that China is violating the International Biological and Toxin Weapons Convention. By withholding the samples they are at least constructively stockpiling a lethal pathogen; with full knowledge this action can (and likely will) result in the loss of many lives. The appropriate response is to announce travel restrictions on all travelers originating from China, effective in 30 days. I expect th…

> One would therefore expect the US will obtain samples by other means From the article: ”At least four research institutions have relied upon a small group of H7N9 samples from cases in Taiwan and Hong Kong. (All four asked not to be identified for fear of further straining ties.)” That said, a travel ban on travelers originating from or having recently been to China is too harsh. Mandatory quarantines (with the cos…

I think the travel ban is meant to be punitive as much as it is a quarantine. I think the way the OP was suggesting it was travel restrictions to or from a country refusing to cooperate with treaties. Implemented in 30 days, not anyone who has traveled to China within 30 days.

Re: China Has Withheld Samples of a Dangerous Flu Virus

#23

Post by throwahate1231 »

Krasnol wrote: post #10
azurezyq wrote: post #4

While I'm not sure why Chinese government is not sharing the virus, I really don't like the way the article is written. The entire article is about guessing the reasons and developing a conspiracy (even the relation to trade war). No response so far from the official channel of Chinese government. Also for this section: >> The Chinese government has refused to share clinical data from infected patients, according to…

The only conspiracy here is, that you can be sure to find someone downplaying the issue every time something regarding China comes up here.

I am posting anonymously here because of all the toxicity of this comment. Take away "Chinese" from his argument and he still has an argument. Your comment on the other hand, is just throwing your emotions around. I suspect other commenters downvote him for the same reason. I find this every time an article about China comes up. Its infuriating because there is not legitimate discussion going on. It simply a downvoting war.

Re: China Has Withheld Samples of a Dangerous Flu Virus

#24

Post by captain_perl »

some_account wrote: post #20
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Unlike the US government which is completely sane and trustworthy Compared to the Chinese government, yes. Competitive governments are more transparent and less corrupt than dictatorships. If one divides the world into binary categories of “never lies” and “has ever lied,” sure, both Beijing and D.C. lie. But in frequency and magnitude, the former knocks it out of the park.

It's not about lying. It's about using weapons of mass destruction. Only one country did this. Twice. It was not China. You guys are just used to the devil you know, and scared of the devil you don't know. I am also in a way. But worrying about China having a virus? What do you think the US have? Both China and US will blame any virus on someone else if it comes out to play.

Just to correct the record, several nations have used poison gas both in combat and against civilians.

The USA used 2 atomic bombs on dual civilian/military targets in WW2 after Japan refused to surrender, but there were also firestorms started by multiple countries using conventional bombs.

Re: China Has Withheld Samples of a Dangerous Flu Virus

#25

Post by hd4 »

Krasnol wrote: post #10
azurezyq wrote: post #4

While I'm not sure why Chinese government is not sharing the virus, I really don't like the way the article is written. The entire article is about guessing the reasons and developing a conspiracy (even the relation to trade war). No response so far from the official channel of Chinese government. Also for this section: >> The Chinese government has refused to share clinical data from infected patients, according to…

The only conspiracy here is, that you can be sure to find someone downplaying the issue every time something regarding China comes up here.

Its not even a conspiracy or disguised anymore, at least on HN, its become the norm.

Re: China Has Withheld Samples of a Dangerous Flu Virus

#26

Post by pishpash »

emodendroket wrote: post #19
defnotarobot wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Does the timing even make sense for attributing the delay to trade tensions? If theyve delayed for more than a year, those tensions were not at their present level a year ago.

The article says that scientists fear that trade tensions will worsen the problem, not that the problem sprang up out of the ether a couple of months ago.

The problem that sprang up out of the ether is the trade war and the subsequent very blatant propaganda war. Note that I'm not saying there is no problem here, but the fact that the story lay dormant and pops up now is not a coincidence. At the very least some NY Times editors thought it was relevant and opportune to shout into the echo chamber right this moment (and the same here, for posting it).

Re: China Has Withheld Samples of a Dangerous Flu Virus

#27

Post by hd4 »

throwahate1231 wrote: post #23
Krasnol wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only conspiracy here is, that you can be sure to find someone downplaying the issue every time something regarding China comes up here.

I am posting anonymously here because of all the toxicity of this comment. Take away "Chinese" from his argument and he still has an argument. Your comment on the other hand, is just throwing your emotions around. I suspect other commenters downvote him for the same reason. I find this every time an article about China comes up. Its infuriating because there is not legitimate discussion going on. It simply a downvoti…

Its not emotional when what he says is borne out by the direction any such discussion takes. What's wrong with questioning the obviously-concerted effort of downplaying anything done by the Chinese government, especially when we have a good idea of who is behind it (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/50_Cent_Party , https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https:/...)?

Re: China Has Withheld Samples of a Dangerous Flu Virus

#28

Post by [deleted] »

captain_perl wrote: post #24
some_account wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not about lying. It's about using weapons of mass destruction. Only one country did this. Twice. It was not China. You guys are just used to the devil you know, and scared of the devil you don't know. I am also in a way. But worrying about China having a virus? What do you think the US have? Both China and US will blame any virus on someone else if it comes out to play.

Just to correct the record, several nations have used poison gas both in combat and against civilians. The USA used 2 atomic bombs on dual civilian/military targets in WW2 after Japan refused to surrender, but there were also firestorms started by multiple countries using conventional bombs.

[deleted]

Re: China Has Withheld Samples of a Dangerous Flu Virus

#29

Post by sctb »

some_account wrote: post #20
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Unlike the US government which is completely sane and trustworthy Compared to the Chinese government, yes. Competitive governments are more transparent and less corrupt than dictatorships. If one divides the world into binary categories of “never lies” and “has ever lied,” sure, both Beijing and D.C. lie. But in frequency and magnitude, the former knocks it out of the park.

It's not about lying. It's about using weapons of mass destruction. Only one country did this. Twice. It was not China. You guys are just used to the devil you know, and scared of the devil you don't know. I am also in a way. But worrying about China having a virus? What do you think the US have? Both China and US will blame any virus on someone else if it comes out to play.

If you won't stop posting unsubstantive flamewar-style comments we'll ban the account.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: China Has Withheld Samples of a Dangerous Flu Virus

#30

Post by emodendroket »

pishpash wrote: post #26
emodendroket wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The article says that scientists fear that trade tensions will worsen the problem, not that the problem sprang up out of the ether a couple of months ago.

The problem that sprang up out of the ether is the trade war and the subsequent very blatant propaganda war. Note that I'm not saying there is no problem here, but the fact that the story lay dormant and pops up now is not a coincidence. At the very least some NY Times editors thought it was relevant and opportune to shout into the echo chamber right this moment (and the same here, for posting it).

There's a link to an older story about the same topic right at the bottom of the page.
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