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Maybe Your Sleep Problem Isn’t a Problem

nytimes.com

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Re: Maybe Your Sleep Problem Isn’t a Problem

#141

Post by thirdsun »

Retric wrote: post #68
adrianmonk wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When it comes to work (or other morning activities), I think there are actually two aspects to this that often get confused. One is what you're talking about: the way people regard waking up early as virtuous. The other is that, how early or late you arrive to an event sends signals about your attitude toward the event. Or at least it is interpreted that way. For example, if you are very excited about seeing a partic…

Showing up a little late to a party is more courteous as the hosts have just a little more time to set things up without needing to entertain people. Showing up early on the other hand often put's people who are not ready on the spot. If you regularly host parties who will get annoyed at people that show up 30+ minutes early unless they are willing to help.

To be fair these expectations vary wildly between cultures and countries. Where I come from the starting time of a party/event is regarded as actual starting time. You’re welcome, not expected, to arrive at that time and while there might be some minor preparations left, you’re in no way expected to help by being on time.

However there was a reddit thread (or was it HN?) a few weeks back discussing this very issue and if i remember correctly being on time was considered almost rude in brazil as well as a number of other countries,

Re: Maybe Your Sleep Problem Isn’t a Problem

#142

Post by cc-d »

krapsna wrote: post #98
cc-d wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honestly, I've found marijuana functions better as a sleep aid than benadryl/melatonin/etc. It might be something worth looking into, as it's probably the most powerful 'sleep-aid' available which doesn't cause long-term dependency or health issues. Long term benadryl use is pretty bad for your brain/body. Long term use of anticholinergics in general has been strongly linked to the development of various severe healt…

I appreciate you and the other poster pointing out that long term benadryl use isn't good. I really wasn't aware of that. I appreciate the marijuana suggestion too, but I find that I'm unable to sleep after partaking. I get intermittent erratic heartbeats that make it impossible :(

I've experienced what you're describing, and have observed it in friends. It's usually indicative of heightened anxiety levels, due to the THC.

THC itself is certainly prone to triggering incredible amounts of anxiety, especially in the high-concentrations found in modern weed. In the quest for increased potency, many strains have been heavily modified to have the highest THC content possible, sometimes up to even 50x normal levels.

THC is only part of the equation, though. The "other" (there are many, but these two are primarily what people care about) cannabinoid, CBD, is linked to the 'calming' and 'pain relieving' effects associated with marijuana.

I would suggest trying to find a strain with a very high CBD:THC ratio before giving up completely. From personal experience, high CBD strains alleviate the anxiety I used to experience whenever all I could find was high-THC sativas.

Strains are usually split into three categories, sativa, hybrid, and indica. You can research these more yourself if interested, but usually indica strains are more associated with 'sleep' and 'relaxation', whereas sativas typically cause a more energetic head high.

tl;dr You might want to try a high CBD indica/hybrid strain before giving up on marijuana alltogether. The effect profiles are dramatically different between different strains, and a high CBD indica strain could be life changing when it comes to pursuing consistent sleep.

This may be more than you wanted to know, but as somebody who has also struggled with often debilitating sleep issues and has tried __every__ sleep aid, marijuana allows me to sleep better than anything non-dependency forming.

The only sleep-aids I've found to be more effective than marijuana are GABAergic drugs such as benzodiazepines (klonopin) or z-drugs (ambien). The main problem with these is that they are HEAVILY dependency forming, and once dependency is developed, can actually straight up kill you from withdrawals. They are incredibly powerful tools which will certainly allow to you sleep, but considering their addictive potential should be relied upon as a last resort. For short-term treatment of insomnia however, they can be literally life saving.

Re: Maybe Your Sleep Problem Isn’t a Problem

#143

Post by krapsna »

njarboe wrote: post #114
krapsna wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Note: I pounded this out pretty quickly and don't have time to proofread. Sorry for any grammatical errors. I will say some of these articles sometimes read satirically. Notably, they have a diagnosis for people who can't sleep at 'normal' hours: Delayed Sleep Phase Syndrome. I have been struggling with being unable to sleep during normal hours my entire life. My parents would yank the covers off of me in the morning…

My more charitable reading of dtien's comment was that instead of society understanding that different people have different preferred behaviors and that some of those preferences are going to have a genetic reason for them, we end up creating pathologies for normal behavior with names like "Delayed Sleep Phase Syndrome". This name does sounds like it would come from a satirist, not the medical establishment. The quo…

I see you point, but I'd like to add that for people such as me it's not a preference, it's hard coded.

Re: Maybe Your Sleep Problem Isn’t a Problem

#144

Post by krapsna »

cc-d wrote: post #142
krapsna wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I appreciate you and the other poster pointing out that long term benadryl use isn't good. I really wasn't aware of that. I appreciate the marijuana suggestion too, but I find that I'm unable to sleep after partaking. I get intermittent erratic heartbeats that make it impossible :(

I've experienced what you're describing, and have observed it in friends. It's usually indicative of heightened anxiety levels, due to the THC. THC itself is certainly prone to triggering incredible amounts of anxiety, especially in the high-concentrations found in modern weed. In the quest for increased potency, many strains have been heavily modified to have the highest THC content possible, sometimes up to even 50…

Thanks for the advice. I too have tried ambien, rozerem, and trazodone, and they have all lost effectiveness within a few days.

I've been considering giving CBD oil a shot, I've heard that it's helpful from a friend. I guess it's time to pull the trigger.

Re: Maybe Your Sleep Problem Isn’t a Problem

#145

Post by dtien »

krapsna wrote: post #30
dtien wrote: post #2

As someone who also has atypical sleep patterns ( late sleeper, early riser ), there were some interesting points in here. I know there's been research done as well on the number of hours of sleep required rather than 'when' it occurs, but those haven't seem to have reached a consensus yet. I will say some of these articles sometimes read satirically. Notably, they have a diagnosis for people who can't sleep at 'norm…

Note: I pounded this out pretty quickly and don't have time to proofread. Sorry for any grammatical errors. I will say some of these articles sometimes read satirically. Notably, they have a diagnosis for people who can't sleep at 'normal' hours: Delayed Sleep Phase Syndrome. I have been struggling with being unable to sleep during normal hours my entire life. My parents would yank the covers off of me in the morning…

Hey Krapsna, my satirical read was in regards to the hyper scientific labels of "Delayed Sleep Phase Syndrome", "team energetic asynchrony", and "chronotype diversity".

Re: Maybe Your Sleep Problem Isn’t a Problem

#146

Post by dtien »

njarboe wrote: post #114
krapsna wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Note: I pounded this out pretty quickly and don't have time to proofread. Sorry for any grammatical errors. I will say some of these articles sometimes read satirically. Notably, they have a diagnosis for people who can't sleep at 'normal' hours: Delayed Sleep Phase Syndrome. I have been struggling with being unable to sleep during normal hours my entire life. My parents would yank the covers off of me in the morning…

My more charitable reading of dtien's comment was that instead of society understanding that different people have different preferred behaviors and that some of those preferences are going to have a genetic reason for them, we end up creating pathologies for normal behavior with names like "Delayed Sleep Phase Syndrome". This name does sounds like it would come from a satirist, not the medical establishment. The quo…

Yes, exactly! Couldn't have said it better myself.

Re: Maybe Your Sleep Problem Isn’t a Problem

#147

Post by acconrad »

internet_user wrote: post #56
acconrad wrote: post #6

This feels like this article was written in response to this article from Slate Star Codex since this also mentions DSPS: http://slatestarcodex.com/2018/07/10/melatonin-much-more-tha... > I have it fairly bad. My body naturally wants to go to bed around 2 a.m. and rise around 10 a.m. That was my cycle as well and I wouldn't describe it as "fairly bad" it's definitely later but not egregious. The SSC article recommend…

Please share more detail. do you use it chronically? why 0.3mg?

Every day. Read the SlateStarCodex article for an explanation on why

Re: Maybe Your Sleep Problem Isn’t a Problem

#148

Post by acconrad »

barleymash wrote: post #23
acconrad wrote: post #6

This feels like this article was written in response to this article from Slate Star Codex since this also mentions DSPS: http://slatestarcodex.com/2018/07/10/melatonin-much-more-tha... > I have it fairly bad. My body naturally wants to go to bed around 2 a.m. and rise around 10 a.m. That was my cycle as well and I wouldn't describe it as "fairly bad" it's definitely later but not egregious. The SSC article recommend…

Do you feel like your "new" schedule is more beneficial than it was before?

Yes, at a minimum because I'm not scrambling to get ready for work because I've already been up a few hours and have time to handle my own personal projects in the morning as opposed to in the evening when I'm too tired to make the effort.

Re: Maybe Your Sleep Problem Isn’t a Problem

#149

Post by acconrad »

wycy wrote: post #8
acconrad wrote: post #6

This feels like this article was written in response to this article from Slate Star Codex since this also mentions DSPS: http://slatestarcodex.com/2018/07/10/melatonin-much-more-tha... > I have it fairly bad. My body naturally wants to go to bed around 2 a.m. and rise around 10 a.m. That was my cycle as well and I wouldn't describe it as "fairly bad" it's definitely later but not egregious. The SSC article recommend…

Did you need to use melatonin only for those few weeks that it took to adjust your schedule, or have you had to continue using it indefinitely to maintain this schedule?

I only started a few weeks ago so I'll let you know, but I can say so far I haven't been militant about using melatonin every day and already I'm still able to go to (and fall) asleep at the earlier time.

Re: Maybe Your Sleep Problem Isn’t a Problem

#150

Post by creep »

krapsna wrote: post #143
njarboe wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My more charitable reading of dtien's comment was that instead of society understanding that different people have different preferred behaviors and that some of those preferences are going to have a genetic reason for them, we end up creating pathologies for normal behavior with names like "Delayed Sleep Phase Syndrome". This name does sounds like it would come from a satirist, not the medical establishment. The quo…

I see you point, but I'd like to add that for people such as me it's not a preference, it's hard coded.

From najrboe's reply:

>some of those preferences are going to have a genetic reason for them

It's hard coded for you, that's understood. The argument is that it's silly to have a distinguisher for everything that doesn't fit into society's majority notions, or for everything that falls outside a "normal" range (or, what we perceive to be normal, even if it's not a true reflection of the average population). Everybody has preferences that help them function-- some preferences have a genetic basis, others don't, but in either case preferences help people function and it would be productive to shift the notions held by society that being flexible towards such preferences is going to lead to a happier populace.

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