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Consider applying for grad school

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Re: Consider applying for grad school

#91

Post by dragonwriter »

deviationblue wrote: post #86
tommymachine wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Corollary being: can a PhD make up for lack of real world experience?

Not, if your PhD is in something mindless, like political science.

Political science isn't, at all, mindless, and there are focus areas within it that are extremely rigorous either elitist or analytically or both.

OTOH, there's not a lot of places where a PoliSci Ph.D. would substitute for industry experience (or, for that matter, vice versa.) If you want to substitute an academic degree in that general space for “industry” experience, you go for public policy and/or public administration (or, arguably, law), not political science.

Re: Consider applying for grad school

#92

Post by yontherubicon »

mchahn wrote: post #76

I assume this refers to a PHD. The masters degree I got is also post-grad. I'm not sure if anyone else covered it but you have to have a certain amount of money to get a PHD. I was approved to enter a doctorate program at Stanford. I couldn't afford it so I went to HP to earn some money. After the five-year approval expired I was disappointed that I could never afford it. (We're talking astronomical numbers here).

What?

Doctoral programs pay you through stipends. You shouldn't have to pay for any doctoral program, ever.

Re: Consider applying for grad school

#93

Post by monocasa »

rm_-rf_slash wrote: post #90
monocasa wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've seen it among many managers from several companies. After I got involved in the hiring process I saw why. Like unable to fizzbuzz more than half the time.

By the time I finish my M Eng I will have a cutting edge education in machine learning, robotics, computer vision, and natural language processing, on top of five solid years of paid programming experience. If someone insists on making a hiring decision based on my ability to whip out fizzbuzz on a whiteboard under a ticking clock, find another person and waste their time. I’ll pass.

If you can't fizzbuzz, I'm not going to hire you. Not being able to isn't defensible.

I'm going to be real, what I'm assuming is a near completed master's student complaining about fizzbuzz not being fair is kind of proving my point.

Re: Consider applying for grad school

#94

Post by solomatov »

dwaltrip wrote: post #34

One point jumped out at me, which I haven't seen anyone respond to: > We are concerned about untrained amateurs going directly into trying to solve very difficult global problems. They can then cause harm overall, by lowering the average quality of analysis or launching ill-considered projects due to a lack of experience or understanding. A PhD reduces the risk you’ll accidentally do this. This point is operating off…

>We are concerned about untrained amateurs going directly into trying to solve very difficult global problems.

It's a black and white thinking. Why people who don't have PhD are amateurs? Why person having MBA, MD, JD, MA or BS degree isn't professional?

Re: Consider applying for grad school

#95

Post by mchahn »

yontherubicon wrote: post #92
mchahn wrote: post #76

I assume this refers to a PHD. The masters degree I got is also post-grad. I'm not sure if anyone else covered it but you have to have a certain amount of money to get a PHD. I was approved to enter a doctorate program at Stanford. I couldn't afford it so I went to HP to earn some money. After the five-year approval expired I was disappointed that I could never afford it. (We're talking astronomical numbers here).

What? Doctoral programs pay you through stipends. You shouldn't have to pay for any doctoral program, ever.

Hmm. When I told the professor trying to "hire" me that I couldn't afford it there was no mention of a stipend. Could it have been different in the 1970s?

Pricing on Stanford website (https://registrar.stanford.edu/students/tuition-and-fees):

Each graduate Engineering unit above 18 is $1200.

Re: Consider applying for grad school

#96

Post by TTPrograms »

Nimitz14 wrote: post #52
asdfasgasdgasdg wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I read the whole article, including the "why not to get a PhD part." I still thought it was way too kind to the "get a PhD" side of the equation. PhDs represent a tremendous opportunity cost, and I have not seen good evidence that they causally improve outcomes in the vast majority of cases.

This may shock you, but some people prefer doing research to working a normal job and earning lots of money. Those are the types of people that should and will do PhDs (there are unfortunately a lot who think like you and still try and do a PhD for god knows what reason).

You don't need a PhD to do research. All information is free now. It's fully possible for individuals to self teach in a working environment and be capable of performing effective research with 2-4 years of good experience after undergrad. To assume that the only way to accomplish this is via PhD is silly. This is especially the case when talking about computer science fields, where the barrier to entry is basically owning a cell phone.

Re: Consider applying for grad school

#97

Post by mehrdadn »

solomatov wrote: post #94
dwaltrip wrote: post #34

One point jumped out at me, which I haven't seen anyone respond to: > We are concerned about untrained amateurs going directly into trying to solve very difficult global problems. They can then cause harm overall, by lowering the average quality of analysis or launching ill-considered projects due to a lack of experience or understanding. A PhD reduces the risk you’ll accidentally do this. This point is operating off…

>We are concerned about untrained amateurs going directly into trying to solve very difficult global problems. It's a black and white thinking. Why people who don't have PhD are amateurs? Why person having MBA, MD, JD, MA or BS degree isn't professional?

How is this black and white thinking? The sentence was "A PhD reduces the risk you’ll accidentally do this", not "a PhD will prevent this" or "you're an amateur if you only have a BS". It's taking about risks and likelihoods. That's not black and white thinking, that's pretty much the exact opposite.

Re: Consider applying for grad school

#98

Post by purplezooey »

dwaltrip wrote: post #34

One point jumped out at me, which I haven't seen anyone respond to: > We are concerned about untrained amateurs going directly into trying to solve very difficult global problems. They can then cause harm overall, by lowering the average quality of analysis or launching ill-considered projects due to a lack of experience or understanding. A PhD reduces the risk you’ll accidentally do this. This point is operating off…

yeah that one I jumped out at me too. Whoah, guy.

Re: Consider applying for grad school

#99

Post by Fomite »

dwaltrip wrote: post #59
sebleon wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not an unreasonable opinion, but I doubt a PhD can make up for lack of real-world experience. Likely, the best way to get better at solving global problems is by doing just that for years, preferably alongside others with more experience. IMO learn to swim in the pool.

I've wondered if working for 10 or so years and then getting a PhD could be a good strategy.

There are several PhD programs in the public health sphere that require work experience for admission.

Re: Consider applying for grad school

#100

Post by Fomite »

dwaltrip wrote: post #34

One point jumped out at me, which I haven't seen anyone respond to: > We are concerned about untrained amateurs going directly into trying to solve very difficult global problems. They can then cause harm overall, by lowering the average quality of analysis or launching ill-considered projects due to a lack of experience or understanding. A PhD reduces the risk you’ll accidentally do this. This point is operating off…

This definitely speaks to some of my experiences, both interacting with people doing health-related work and in data science-related stuff.
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