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Disable SMT/Hyperthreading in all Intel BIOSes

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Re: Disable SMT/Hyperthreading in all Intel BIOSes

#151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

AWS is able to get custom Intel Processors due to their size (c5 instances have a custom Intel processor).

Makes sense. I sure would like some custom processors. :-)

Well, fabbing using reasonably respectable processes only runs circa $2000/mm2 or so, and using crazy old process nodes like CMOS et al gets you down to $300/mm2, so you could very well make something.

Technically.

(I want to...)

Re: Disable SMT/Hyperthreading in all Intel BIOSes

#152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed, the idea of "Security" is not negotiable when marketing. Imagine buying a car that says, "Save $5000 for a less safe version without airbags." Yes, I know Airbags are DOT requirement, just trying to make a point. Edit: I think people are missing my point. I am not saying they don't sell cheaper models that are less safe. My point is that they don't ACTIVELY market them as such. Point me to an advertisement th…

...and people still buy motorcycles (which are significantly cheaper), proving that "security" or "safety" is not an absolute, nor a must-have.

bold statement regarding the price of motorcycles..

Re: Disable SMT/Hyperthreading in all Intel BIOSes

#153

I would love to but how in the world do I do this when I'm using Windows and Lenovo doesn't give me an option in the BIOS?

One way to achieve something similar would be via a software tool which would set the process affinity to only run on real cores. Or you could only run Chrome (untrusted JavaScript) on core 2 and 3, and run the app that has your secrets on core 0 and 1. (It is my understanding that 2k cores are real, and 2k+1 is their matching, "virtual" core) This way you get both hyperthreading and security. I'm not a security expe…

> It is my understanding that 2k cores are real, and 2k+1 is their matching, "virtual" core)

I'm not sure that's true. For example, on a i7-4770 I get:

  $ cat /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu[0-3]/topology/thread_siblings_list
  0,4
  1,5
  2,6
  3,7
(Of course, that might just be Linux renumbering them)

Re: Disable SMT/Hyperthreading in all Intel BIOSes

#154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some of us like using websites.

Many actually improve when you disble JS

But a non-zero amount will completely break or not show anything at all (even though the actual content to be displayed is just static text and doesn't need any JS)

Re: Disable SMT/Hyperthreading in all Intel BIOSes

#155
There are some comments here talking about the possibility of getting better performance without HT. Here's an article from a test (on Intel only) of that theory: https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=intel-ht...

In the end, the conclusion is: "Long story short, Hyper Threading is still very much relevant in 2018 with current-generation Intel CPUs. In the threaded workloads that could scale past a few threads, HT/SMT on this Core i7 8700K processor yielded about a 30% performance improvement in many of these real-world test cases."

Re: Disable SMT/Hyperthreading in all Intel BIOSes

#156

Scary looking headline on a discussion forum with instructions to perform a task that the average user would not really understand, with no explanation of attack vector or even consequences for any user who doesn't want to take the time (and energy, frankly at this point) to follow security news. I'm pretty close to not caring anymore. I hope somebody figures out how to at least fix the security news infrastructure,…

This is not security news at all. This is Theo de Raadt's personal E-mail sent to the OpenBSD development mailing list for system developers. It is never intended for the consumption by the general public.

Hah, okay. I'm not familiar with OpenBSD so I didn't know who Theo was. Well, that would be good to know, let's say, on the HN headline.

Thanks!

Re: Disable SMT/Hyperthreading in all Intel BIOSes

#157
post #80
post #38

Will be interesting to see what Apple does about this in their next software update. I can’t imagine many people will be happy if the next software update forcibly disables hyper threading. (For those who aren’t familiar with Apple devices, Apple don’t expose settings like this to a user, which are usually available in the BIOS on a PC)

Will the loss of HT have apparent consequences on most Intel-based Apple hardware? Very few of them are servers under constant multithreaded load, throughput-oriented. I suppose almost all Macbooks and most Mac Pros will not visibly slow down.

I would expect disabling HT on dual-core systems to have a noticeable performance impact on the desktop.

Re: Disable SMT/Hyperthreading in all Intel BIOSes

#158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i'm pretty sure this is not true: The most recent example i remember is: https://lobste.rs/s/dwzplh/krack_attacks_breaking_wpa2#c_pbh...

This is common misinformation. Even in this case, OpenBSD did not break the embargo. After protesting, they received the permission of the researcher to publish: Note that I wrote and included a suggested diff for OpenBSD already, and that at the time the tentative disclosure deadline was around the end of August. As a compromise, I allowed them to silently patch the vulnerability. ( https://www.krackattacks.com/#ope…

[deleted]

Re: Disable SMT/Hyperthreading in all Intel BIOSes

#159
post #116
post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For hypervisors it's automatic. For operating systems, there's no performance penalty. Browsers need not do anything.

Unless the browser is using hypervisor https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2016/09/windo...

It's still the hypervisor (Hyper-V in that case) that has to do the work to mitigate the vulnerability, not the browser. The browser just uses whatever APIs the hypervisor exposes to create a virtual machine.
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