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Netflix is the latest company to try bypassing Apple’s app store

marketwatch.com

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Re: Netflix is the latest company to try bypassing Apple’s app store

#81

Post by chc »

gst wrote: post #29
microtonal wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple and Google not only created the device and funded the R & D for the features, but also created the APIs, the tools, the infrastructure, and attracted the (hundreds of millions of) users. The 30% cut they ask of developers is more than reasonable. Want to bypass that cut? Build a web app and make it play well on mobile. I can understand the argument that they should accept the 30% cut to be listed in and downloa…

> However, an iOS device is also the property of its owner and the owner should be allowed (morally) to install software outside the app store. Even if that comes with potential security problems. Android already permits this. The owner has the choice between iOS and Android. Why should Apple change their policies (and lose revenue) if the majority of users appear to be sufficiently happy with those restrictions (oth…

Because morality does not revolve around the question "Will a megacorp lose some revenue?" There are many things companies and individuals could do that would make them money which they are nonetheless constrained from doing because those things are wrong.

Also, the idea that users understand these issues and are passing judgment on them when they buy an iPhone doesn't seem realistic for the majority of iPhone owners. If you walked around polling iPhone users about this issue anywhere besides Silicon Valley, the most common answer would probably be "What?" And that's ignoring the fact that someone might object to this but still buy an iPhone for unrelated reasons. So even if their dollars could act as moral validation, I don't think it's reasonable to say they do in practice.

Re: Netflix is the latest company to try bypassing Apple’s app store

#82

Post by ryneandal »

bepotts wrote: post #10

Apple and Google not only created the device and funded the R & D for the features, but also created the APIs, the tools, the infrastructure, and attracted the (hundreds of millions of) users. The 30% cut they ask of developers is more than reasonable. Want to bypass that cut? Build a web app and make it play well on mobile. If you want to run it on Android and iOS devices, then I don't really see how anyone can say…

I think the number is too high, but a portion of proceeds to Google/Apple is certainly justified.

At least Epic Games is practicing what they preach. UE4 is free to use, and here's their royalty breakdown:

> UE4 is free to use, with a 5% royalty on gross product revenue after the first $3,000 per game per calendar quarter from commercial products.

Re: Netflix is the latest company to try bypassing Apple’s app store

#83

Post by microtonal »

naravara wrote: post #68
microtonal wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which is a valuable lesson - a lesson in learning to be a rational, critical, grown-up human being. Or we could educate them and it might never happen. Also, let's not forget that many closed system are spyware already. Many of us became deeply involved in tech because some person (thanks Pat Volkerding!) or organization gave us a system were we could do whatever the hell we wanted.

>Many of us became deeply involved in tech because some person (thanks Pat Volkerding!) or organization gave us a system were we could do whatever the hell we wanted. Surely you can understand why letting people do whatever the hell they want might not be the best thing when people's personal and financial data is on the line.

Surely you can understand why letting people do whatever the hell they want might

As a default no. But there should always be an option (with appropriate warnings) to do with your device what you want to do with it.

might not be the best thing when people's personal and financial data is on the line.

Even on a walled garden device people will open phishing mails and log in to phishing websites. There will always be attack vectors. Beyond a reasonable baseline in security (sandboxing between applications, etc.), the most important thing to do is to educate people on proper security practices.

Re: Netflix is the latest company to try bypassing Apple’s app store

#84

Post by TheCoelacanth »

bepotts wrote: post #79
microtonal wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple and Google not only created the device and funded the R & D for the features, but also created the APIs, the tools, the infrastructure, and attracted the (hundreds of millions of) users. The 30% cut they ask of developers is more than reasonable. Want to bypass that cut? Build a web app and make it play well on mobile. I can understand the argument that they should accept the 30% cut to be listed in and downloa…

Only on the internet does the notion of a "gatekeeper" leading to some authoritarian universe make sense. In the real word, it isn't immoral to sell devices that don't run non-trusted binaries. If Tim Cook and Sundar Pichai could speak to every user and tell them "the reason our platform's default behavior is to not run non-trusted apps is because we don't want your device to get viruses or perform non-trusted functi…

It's reasonable as a default choice. It's not reasonable as the only choice.

Re: Netflix is the latest company to try bypassing Apple’s app store

#85

Post by xxs »

jryan49 wrote: post #26
MiddleEndian wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hopefully these kids will be exposed to the idea that they can choose what software they use rather than being limited to a curated store.

They will most likely be scammed into downloading spyware.

Darn, this is really "think of the kids" all over.

You don't need to download spyware with virtually any mobile phone, pretty much everyone out there is doing already(recent ref: google maps)

Re: Netflix is the latest company to try bypassing Apple’s app store

#86

Post by hamandcheese »

bepotts wrote: post #10

Apple and Google not only created the device and funded the R & D for the features, but also created the APIs, the tools, the infrastructure, and attracted the (hundreds of millions of) users. The 30% cut they ask of developers is more than reasonable. Want to bypass that cut? Build a web app and make it play well on mobile. If you want to run it on Android and iOS devices, then I don't really see how anyone can say…

Some might say the $600-$1000 price tag paid by consumers should reasonably cover everything.

Re: Netflix is the latest company to try bypassing Apple’s app store

#87

Post by microtonal »

orf wrote: post #64
microtonal wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which is a valuable lesson - a lesson in learning to be a rational, critical, grown-up human being. Or we could educate them and it might never happen. Also, let's not forget that many closed system are spyware already. Many of us became deeply involved in tech because some person (thanks Pat Volkerding!) or organization gave us a system were we could do whatever the hell we wanted.

> Which is a valuable lesson - a lesson in learning to be a rational, critical, grown-up human being. Well... you can phrase it like some life lesson, sure. In reality 1% of 3 million kids clicking on 'Free vbux!!' and converting is 30,000 kids having malware ridden phones, doing god knows what to god knows who. Is increasing the profits of malware distributors by so much really worth some hand-wavy "teach kids to be…

In reality 1% of 3 million kids clicking on 'Free vbux!!' and converting is 30,000 kids having malware ridden phones, doing god knows what to god knows who.

Well, most of those kids will run outdated Android versions with many known vulnerabilities. And they cannot update their phones, because they have locked firmware and walled-garden OS, largely put in place to make them buy new phones.

Again, the proper solution beyond a good security baseline is to educate people.

Re: Netflix is the latest company to try bypassing Apple’s app store

#88

Post by shady-lady »

bepotts wrote: post #46
peatmoss wrote: post #20

I miss the idea that a platform, applications, and marketplace were not a vertical stack owned by one entity. As a consumer, I’d love to buy a phone, not a content distribution straight jacket.

As a consumer, I love it. I love that I buy an iPhone and Apple doesn't allow any non-trusted binaries to run on my phone, enforces strict style guidelines (the average app just looks better on my iPhone than Android IMO), has one place where all possible apps are, maintains a distribution channels that allows all my apps to be updated easily, and builds hardware and software that is designed to work together. I love…

I don't quite get the last sentence.

> who could look at how Europe treats Android and come to the conclusion that Google made the right decision by being open?

Google was fined on antitrust grounds. I don't see which direction to leap to make that sentence relevant to them being fined.

From the EU’s competition commissioner

> Fine of €4,34 bn to @Google for 3 types of illegal restrictions on the use of Android. In this way it has cemented the dominance of its search engine. Denying rivals a chance to innovate and compete on the merits. It’s illegal under EU antitrust rules. @Google now has to stop it

Re: Netflix is the latest company to try bypassing Apple’s app store

#90

Post by tolmasky »

Ultimately it’s of course their choice, but I truly believe that a “fee-less” App Store would be better for the party that so seldom gets mentioned: me, the consumer. I’m the one that’s ultimately paying the 30%, not the apps. I already paid 1000$ for this phone, if I spend money on Netflix I want that money going to making great tv shows, all of it, not 70% of it.
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