Interesting that they use Kubernetes exclusively for edge computing resources (as opposed to their cloud architecture). Never really considered this approach before.
Edge Computing at Chick-fil-A
301–310 of 401 posts
Re: Edge Computing at Chick-fil-A
#302From other retail IT I've been involved with, these guys could make an incredibly successful side business doing this to pretty much any retailer. However when I see that retail stores are using dialup to do batch uploads of inventory and transactions I wonder if their central IT systems would be remotely ready for something like this.
Re: Edge Computing at Chick-fil-A
#303Pretty interesting, but good lord I've never seen such buzzword-density in an article that's making real sense
Re: Edge Computing at Chick-fil-A
#304Earlier quoted context omitted.
The paradox of intolerance[1]: being tolerant of those who are intolerant leads to less tolerance. It is completely right to call out intolerant views and actions and work towards eliminating them. [1] https://www.wikiwand.com/en/Paradox_of_tolerance
The obvious problems with 'the paradox of intolerance' being that anyone who can convince themselves of another's intolerance now has moral license to behave intolerantly to an unspecified degree. Of course, exactly this sort of thing happens all the time; notably, it was used to rationalize Google's firing of James Damore--Damore's memo allegedly contained "dogwhistles" so he deserved being fired, slandered by the m…
I'm inclined to divide intolerances into two types: intolerances based on what somebody thinks, and intolerance based on what somebody is. I'm further inclined to model intolerances as a directed graph where nodes represent a group of one of those two types, e.g. conservatives and men might be represented by individual nodes of those two types respectively. Edges represent an intolerance, e.g. there would be an edge pointing from Klan members to black people. The former node would be of the first type, the latter of the second.
Where there's a cycle in this graph we are seeing a mutual intolerance of people with different ideas. An example might be people who think the Earth is flat and people who think it is round. Who is right? It's impossible to say without diving into the issues themselves.
flat earthers round earthers
Because what you think is independent of what you are, nodes of the second type cannot have outgoing edges. Incoming edges represent base intolerances of the sort that have historically been very harmful: racism, sexism, homophobia, and so on. Obviously these edges represent a different type of intolerance because they are based on innate attributes that their targets have no control over. To a liberal person, they are essentially definitionally bad. To an illiberal person, they're fine. Great, even, depending on who you ask.Note that I'm talking about liberalism in the general definitional sense, not in the modern U.S. politics sense (i.e. "the left").
So, how about this graph taken from real life (the represents two edges, one pointing in each direction):
anti-racists white racists -> non-whites
Deletion of the rightmost edge (i.e. deletion of white racism) means that we also have to delete 'white racists' or the implied meaning of the graph is paradoxical. It then follows that we have to remove 'anti-racists'. Now we have no intolerance at all—all that's left in the graph is `non-whites`, enjoying their existence without harassment, and all it took was the elimination of racism. You could also remove the 'white racists' node, with similar meaning and identical effect.However, deletion of 'anti-racists' leaves the racism intact. I'd argue that this form of graph appears in many places where there is an illiberal group intolerant of a type two group and a liberal group locked in mutual intolerance with the illiberal group. The inverse setup doesn't really appear because, as I noted before, edges pointing to type two nodes represent a sort of intolerance that is anathema to liberals.
I'd also argue that there is a strong implication that these sorts of edges are the most important to remove—because, as demonstrated, doing so causes the rest of the graph to collapse. They are the "root cause", if you will, of many webs of interconnected intolerances.
It should be obvious that this model denies the assertion made by many modern American 'conservatives' that intolerances are all equivalent and relative, "the tolerant left", etcetera. I would say the water is most muddied by the fact that our 'left' and 'right' do not map cleanly onto liberal and illiberal. It's easy and sexy—but invalid—to apply the same political label to someone who thinks gay couples should be able to enjoy the same legal benefits as heterosexual married couples, and someone who thinks all white people should be killed.
P.S. Damore is a moron and his pseudoscientific screed was legitimately offensive to his co-workers. That's fine justification for him to be fired from his job at a private company. As for the rest of it, we live in a culture of growing illiberalism and zeal for generating outrage. It's a bummer.
Re: Edge Computing at Chick-fil-A
#305Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'm just trying to understand, I see three of those machines, inside a pretty nice rack, with the switches, routers, a keyboard, I would assume some fairly high quality hard drive / RAID type of thing etc. then the blog post claims "We run our Edge infrastructure on commodity hardware that costs us, ballpark, $1000/restaurant. ". Just the intel nuc I can find on newegg alone costs $349 each, with no memory or harddri…
This is Caleb (SRE on this project). Here’s a similar NUC we use ... this one is like $300... just an example of what we use; https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1316113-REG/intel_box...
Re: Edge Computing at Chick-fil-A
#306Earlier quoted context omitted.
We have frequent internet outages and still need to run compute loads at the edge.
> compute loads What are you computing? This is what everyone is wondering.
1) MQTT -- we have a lot of cases where we want to share data between physical or "software" devices in-restaurant, without internet connections. MQTT is our primary channel for sharing messages between things, and for collecting data in general to be exfiltrated to the cloud.
2) "Brain" apps -- these are "smart" applications that collect data from MQTT topics and make decisions about what should be done for a given restaurant process. Today, the reality is we do not automatically cook anything. We do, however, have some restaurants that have more intelligent screens to help them know what to cook at any given moment based off of forecasting models that use the data we collect from many different things. These generally run at the edge to preserve their function in cases where there is high latency or bad WAN connections.
3) In the past we had a POS Server in the restaurant. It was a single point of failure for things like drive thru order taking with iPads and mobile orders. The move to K8s lets us run a microservice that can intake mobile orders on a more resilient infrastructure. To be clear, we have not made this shift just yet, but its something we are working on that will ultimately be transparent to customers but that will make their ordering experience more reliable. We have many cases like this.
Overall, our workloads aren't "heavy" which is why we did an array of three moderately sized commodity compute devices. We wanted a smart, sensible ROI on the hardware. We do have enough business-important apps that need to run in a low-latency high-availability environment to push us out of just cloud (internet dependent) and to the Edge. In the future, maybe this can change and we can use cloud only. It seems Edge is an industry trend though, with many workloads moving towards their consumers (a lot of gaming, but a lot of retail as well).
Great question and I hope this helped -- if not just let me know.
Re: Edge Computing at Chick-fil-A
#307Earlier quoted context omitted.
>In a recent post, we shared about how we do bare metal clustering for Kubernetes on-the-fly at the Edge in our restaurants. One of the most common (and best) questions we got was “but why?”. In the post we will answer that question. [emphasis mine] Luckily there's a whole article on that topic. I try to avoid "Did you read the article?" comments, but the first three sentences in the article tell you that this is the…
No, there is some hand-waving about "kitchen equipment" and "low latency". No business case for avoiding more traditional architecture.
Can you help me understand what you mean by "more traditional architecture"?
I'd be happy to share more about why we chose k8s vs alternatives.
Re: Edge Computing at Chick-fil-A
#308Earlier quoted context omitted.
I don't understand what ghost windmill you are tilting at here. At all. It certainly doesn't seem to be anything I've actually said.
I have a pretty personal beef with the idea that language can simply be contorted to supposedly mean whatever someone feels like it should mean, as heading down that road is basically abandoning meaning and communication altogether, and is wholly incoherent.
Re: Edge Computing at Chick-fil-A
#309I work in midtown NYC near a Chick-fil-a location. Used to be a line down the block, went with a friend yesterday thinking we caught the line at a short time but turns out they were using smiley employees with ipads coordinating orders and that they were serving arguably more people than before. Very impressed with how seamlessly they've integrated tech in their brick and mortars in contrast with the countless "cashl…
I have a friend who used to be a shift manager at Chick-fil-A. I can't remember exactly what he called that process... It was like meet and greet or walk and talk, but it's surprisingly efficient for the drive thru. He said it cuts down the average wait time for customers around 15% at his location. I don't know what it would be like at NYC since it's not a drive thru.
Re: Edge Computing at Chick-fil-A
#310Earlier quoted context omitted.
the domain is interesting, but I worry about the long-term effects of maximizing efficiencies (read: automation) forpeople who rely on jobs in that industry.
A myth about manufacturing jobs is that they all went overseas. Reality is that most of them were replaced by robots and automation. Low skill, low knowledge, repetitive work is key target for automation. Fast food workers wouldn't have large downstream effects. Automated truck driving would though. There are likely entire towns right off of highways that depend on humans passing through daily - restaurants, repair s…
I hate talking to machines, I hate talking to automated voice menus instead of getting actual assistance from a human being. I hate ordering stuff online and dealing with slight one off cases. The google Ai assistant had me cringing for weeks. I especially have a deep hatred for self checkout lines. They can all burn in hell.