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National prison strike launches over underpaid labor and prison conditions

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Re: National prison strike launches over underpaid labor and prison conditions

#261

Post by opnitro »

jupiter90000 wrote: post #176
fipple wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think they should pay rent and should be paid proper wages, to accelerate reintroduction to society. Don’t do any work? Get the worst cell, with rent written off. Work as a firefighter? Get $30/hour which you can use to get better living conditions and better food in prison.

There would need to be an equivalent or greater effort to help them obtain jobs and nice living spaces outside of prison, otherwise: "Can't find a job out here! I'm gonna go back to prison and get me that sweet $30/hr prison job, where I can afford nice food and place to live. Also if I don't feel like working they'll take care of me." Not to mention, prisons now incentivized to soak up that larger cashflow and get m…

Perhaps it would do well to reflect on the kind of society that treats people and handles poverty in such a way that they would rather be locked up and almost every aspect of their life controller, because at least they get some food.

Re: National prison strike launches over underpaid labor and prison conditions

#263

Post by fraudsyndrome »

andrewla wrote: post #131

For reference, here is the linked list of demands by the national organizers [1]: > 1. Immediate improvements to the conditions of prisons and prison policies that recognize the humanity of imprisoned men and women. > 2. An immediate end to prison slavery. All persons imprisoned in any place of detention under United States jurisdiction must be paid the prevailing wage in their state or territory for their labor. > 3…

As someone from Australia who doesn't understand the prison thing in the US. Is it essentially modern slavery? They choose non-white demographics, send them to prison for minor offences, and use the for cheap/free labour. Is this right?

Re: National prison strike launches over underpaid labor and prison conditions

#264

Post by solveit »

microcolonel wrote: post #249
fipple wrote: post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Child rapists shouldn’t ever be let out of jail, so it’s irrelevant what happens to them there.

> Child rapists shouldn’t ever be let out of jail Possibly unfortunately (though it's not that simple, as prosecutors, being human, still err), the legislature disagrees with you. With personal experience in a proceeding of a charge like this, I assure you child rapists are usually let out of jail before murderers.

>child rapists are usually let out of jail before murderers.

And for damn good reason. If murder carries a shorter sentence than raping a child, well guess how a rapist might make sure their victim never testifies.

Re: National prison strike launches over underpaid labor and prison conditions

#265

Post by a-fried-egg »

WtfRuSerious wrote: post #206
api_or_ipa wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're totally right. What better way to show inmates the virtue of living an upright life than to treat them just like real people. If you pay them 85c/hr they'll resent The Man even harder and see a life of crime as the only way they'll ever succeed. Pay them for their hardwork and they'll learn they can succeed in life by hardwork, determination and honesty, all virtues that prison _should_ be about instilling.

I'm going to use a alt account for this ( for obvious reasons )... I disagree with this sentiment, I was ( some 20 years ago ) incarcerated for drug dealing. I broke the law ( much more than I was caught and prosecuted for btw... ) and I deserved what I got, probably more. For the record, being in prison sucks... it's SUPPOSED to suck, it's supposed to make you regret what you did to get put in there and actively loo…

I agree. Prison is supposed to suck.

Re: National prison strike launches over underpaid labor and prison conditions

#266

Post by jaccarmac »

WtfRuSerious wrote: post #206
api_or_ipa wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're totally right. What better way to show inmates the virtue of living an upright life than to treat them just like real people. If you pay them 85c/hr they'll resent The Man even harder and see a life of crime as the only way they'll ever succeed. Pay them for their hardwork and they'll learn they can succeed in life by hardwork, determination and honesty, all virtues that prison _should_ be about instilling.

I'm going to use a alt account for this ( for obvious reasons )... I disagree with this sentiment, I was ( some 20 years ago ) incarcerated for drug dealing. I broke the law ( much more than I was caught and prosecuted for btw... ) and I deserved what I got, probably more. For the record, being in prison sucks... it's SUPPOSED to suck, it's supposed to make you regret what you did to get put in there and actively loo…

Using an alt account and that ridiculous-sounding language does the opposite of helping your case.

Re: National prison strike launches over underpaid labor and prison conditions

#267

Post by solveit »

mpax wrote: post #216
jakelazaroff wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The point of a medium of exchange (money) is to make it easy for there to be a coincidence of wants between people who might transact. It has nothing to do with whether you're a "good" or "bad" actor.

Well... sure, but it depends on how you look at it. In a monetary society (as opposed to credit or barter (intermediary like you suggest) — monetary circuitist terminology), money is created as a debt/credit tuple to facilitate an intertemporal private contract (tit-for-tat), of which cash is a physical token representation. The etymology of “credit” is “faith”, “honor”, “merit” etc. That of debt, at least in some ge…

I don't think arguments from etymology are of much relevance in modern economics, to put it mildly.

Re: National prison strike launches over underpaid labor and prison conditions

#268

Post by [deleted] »

ada1981 wrote: post #186
conanbatt wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It’s worth noting that this is a voulenteer program and that for every day you work you get 1 day off your sentence. So you can effectively halve your time in prison. The perverse incentive of increasing prison times to generate more cheap labor.

This is certainly a huge issue. The meta-system is completely fucked, no question. But this subsystem is being presented in a skewed way. Yes it’s $1/hour; but you also earn a day of freedom for each day you work.

[deleted]

Re: National prison strike launches over underpaid labor and prison conditions

#269

Post by jaccarmac »

pasiaj wrote: post #250
WtfRuSerious wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm going to use a alt account for this ( for obvious reasons )... I disagree with this sentiment, I was ( some 20 years ago ) incarcerated for drug dealing. I broke the law ( much more than I was caught and prosecuted for btw... ) and I deserved what I got, probably more. For the record, being in prison sucks... it's SUPPOSED to suck, it's supposed to make you regret what you did to get put in there and actively loo…

Well, the Nordics employ this "stupidest idea ever" and outcomes are definitely better than in the US.

The author of the parent comment seems not to understand recidivism in the United States if they were ever in prison at all. The Nordic example is leagues more potent than an anonymous anecdote.

Re: National prison strike launches over underpaid labor and prison conditions

#270

Post by iamthirsty »

pasiaj wrote: post #250
WtfRuSerious wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm going to use a alt account for this ( for obvious reasons )... I disagree with this sentiment, I was ( some 20 years ago ) incarcerated for drug dealing. I broke the law ( much more than I was caught and prosecuted for btw... ) and I deserved what I got, probably more. For the record, being in prison sucks... it's SUPPOSED to suck, it's supposed to make you regret what you did to get put in there and actively loo…

Well, the Nordics employ this "stupidest idea ever" and outcomes are definitely better than in the US.

Well, things like more lienient drug laws, harsher gun control, and social welfare usually keep people out of prison or from re-offending when they get out. Outcomes are better there because, truthfully, life is better there.
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