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Just Read the Book Already

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Re: Just Read the Book Already

#121

Post by rayiner »

byproxy wrote: post #92
rayiner wrote: post #15

“Readers” are so judgey. There is nothing wrong with reading the wikipedia summary of books instead of the whole thing. I read “Fellowship of the Ring” in middle school. Took forever! Put me off the whole enterprise.

If all you care about are plot details, maybe. But you're missing out on a person's voice. Prose can be as beautiful as any piece of visual art in a gallery. Not only are you depriving yourself of an aesthetic experience, but also a learning experience. Reading will boost your vocabulary and help your writing and give you more cultural references to pull from (and recognize, when they come up in another's work). But.…

> But you're missing out on a person's voice. Prose can be as beautiful as any piece of visual art in a gallery. Not only are you depriving yourself of an aesthetic experience...

Sure, but people who enjoy art don't write high-and-mighty articles titled "Just Go to MOMA Already." "Readers" act like these aesthetic experiences are something that are universally important.

> Reading will boost your vocabulary and help your writing and give you more cultural references to pull from

But this is only valuable if you're writing for other "readers" (which typically you're not).

Re: Just Read the Book Already

#122

Post by emodendroket »

hrktb wrote: post #104
emodendroket wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think the world needs to consist solely of page-turning books that "hook the reader."

Anything written needs to be interesting though. There is no way to escape the time spent / return on investment balance. The return can be entertainment, practical info on a legal subject, or thought provoking opinions on a message board. But the worst the text is written, the higher the return needs to be for the reader to continue reading.

So, for instance, if you're writing an avant-garde novel, the point may be to alienate the reader. That's not really "hooking" them in the traditional sense.

Re: Just Read the Book Already

#123

Post by emodendroket »

jandrese wrote: post #112
emodendroket wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How much 19th-Century writing have you read, man?

I was more comparing to early 20th century works. There seemed to be a period where pages were expensive and authors more often felt the need to get to the point. Novels were considered long if they were more than an inch thick. The Lord of the Rings was considered epic length (it is dwarfed by a Song of Ice and Fire, especially if you count the unfinished works). When you pick up a copy of Fahrenheit 451 one thing y…

If we take so few examples, we can easily make the opposite argument. The Death of Ivan Ilyich and Bartleby the Scrivener are quite a bit shorter than Gravity's Rainbow or For Whom the Bell Tolls.

War and Peace and Moby Dick are both exceptionally compelling, by the way, and the latter was actually much more appreciated in the early 20th Century than when it was written.

Re: Just Read the Book Already

#124

Post by gassiss »

alexhutcheson wrote: post #89

I think most people are too committed to finishing books that they start. Changing my attitude about this has made a huge difference in how much book content I actually read. Until pretty recently, if I found myself reading a book that I found boring, or too dense, or hard to get into, I would just get "stuck". I wouldn't be able to pay attention for long enough to make real progress, but it would "block" me from sta…

The best way to read more books is reading books that you enjoy rather than just because you have the urge to finish it, no doubt.

Re: Just Read the Book Already

#125

Post by gdubs »

AlwaysRock wrote: post #63

I've gone from reading 10 books a year to reading 25+ books a year over the last few years. Mostly I've cut down on my screen time. I am on a computer all day for work but once I go home I try to spend as little time as possible on a computer. What do I do now? Come home, do yoga for 15-30 minutes, make tea, meditate for 10 minutes, read for 15 - 50 minutes. Then I'll allow myself to do other things that may occupy m…

I’m also reading more books than I ever have — and I have kids. Partly it’s because the library is a fun thing for us to do as a family, but also because it’s easier for me to wind down with a book than a screen when they go to bed.

I tend to check out more books than I’ll actually read, looking for the ones that really grab me; I read those through to completion. The ones that change me fundamentally, I buy a copy to hold on to.

I did the Marie Kondo discarding thing with books a couple of years back and it opened up a lot of shelf space; it’s very useful for keeping an always rotating stack of books from the library.

Re: Just Read the Book Already

#126

Post by wilsonnb3 »

byproxy wrote: post #92
rayiner wrote: post #15

“Readers” are so judgey. There is nothing wrong with reading the wikipedia summary of books instead of the whole thing. I read “Fellowship of the Ring” in middle school. Took forever! Put me off the whole enterprise.

If all you care about are plot details, maybe. But you're missing out on a person's voice. Prose can be as beautiful as any piece of visual art in a gallery. Not only are you depriving yourself of an aesthetic experience, but also a learning experience. Reading will boost your vocabulary and help your writing and give you more cultural references to pull from (and recognize, when they come up in another's work). But.…

> Prose can be as beautiful as any piece of visual art in a gallery

For many people, "prose" is just what you have to get through to find out what happens in the plot or to the characters. A lot of people have a minimal appreciation for most forms of art and literature is far more subtle and unappreciated than visual and auditory forms of art.

> Not only are you depriving yourself of an aesthetic experience, but also a learning experience. Reading will boost your vocabulary and help your writing and give you more cultural references to pull from (and recognize, when they come up in another's work).

I'm not sure what the inherent merit you see in boosting one's vocabulary is. I know a lot of words that I never use and no one I know ever uses. If I didn't know them, my life wouldn't be any different.

Reading is important for writers but most of us aren't writers. The vast majority of us that are writers write things like emails, internet comments, and work related documents. Not the kind of thing that reading fiction is going to help with.

As for cultural references, culture has been trending away from literature and towards movies and television for a very long time. I'd go so far as to say that in modern American culture, you're not going to be missing anything by not reading books.

Anyways, it's not that people "can't be assed", it's that books don't hold the same value for them that they hold for you. There's nothing wrong with that.

Re: Just Read the Book Already

#127

Post by BeetleB »

DanielBMarkham wrote: post #48

Wow, do I feel this pain. As both an author[1] and a book-lover, I've been on both sides of this divide. People just don't consume books the same way they used to. As a reader, I find I have to slowly re-introduce deep reading -- even if I've just been away for a week or two. I usually do this by getting a physical book and a physical distraction device, usually my phone. I go to a place where there's nothing else in…

>I don't think I could do it with an e-book reader. In those things, they put the distraction stuff just a click away. Hell, they'll sell you more distraction stuff you can play the millisecond you get bored with the text.

My first ereader did not have wifi. For me, the absence was a feature. Still, I now have a Kobo which has wifi, but I don't find it a distraction at all. Everything is pretty slow - if I wanted to browse the web, it's easier to put down the ereader and do it on my PC or phone. So for me, there isn't any distraction at all.

Re: Just Read the Book Already

#128

Post by jandrese »

emodendroket wrote: post #123
jandrese wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was more comparing to early 20th century works. There seemed to be a period where pages were expensive and authors more often felt the need to get to the point. Novels were considered long if they were more than an inch thick. The Lord of the Rings was considered epic length (it is dwarfed by a Song of Ice and Fire, especially if you count the unfinished works). When you pick up a copy of Fahrenheit 451 one thing y…

If we take so few examples, we can easily make the opposite argument. The Death of Ivan Ilyich and Bartleby the Scrivener are quite a bit shorter than Gravity's Rainbow or For Whom the Bell Tolls. War and Peace and Moby Dick are both exceptionally compelling, by the way, and the latter was actually much more appreciated in the early 20th Century than when it was written.

You were seriously invested with all of those pages on the whaling practices of the 18th century?

Re: Just Read the Book Already

#129

Post by emodendroket »

jandrese wrote: post #128
emodendroket wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If we take so few examples, we can easily make the opposite argument. The Death of Ivan Ilyich and Bartleby the Scrivener are quite a bit shorter than Gravity's Rainbow or For Whom the Bell Tolls. War and Peace and Moby Dick are both exceptionally compelling, by the way, and the latter was actually much more appreciated in the early 20th Century than when it was written.

You were seriously invested with all of those pages on the whaling practices of the 18th century?

You bet your ass I was, but you mean the 19th Century

Re: Just Read the Book Already

#130

Post by commandlinefan »

dmd wrote: post #115
commandlinefan wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> for all technical books, things like O’Reilly, No Starch, etc, I always buy physical Same here. I always feel odd when I'm reading a physical book at my desk, though, since I've never, ever, not even once in 25 years, seen anybody else actually reading a book - not even the ones who have a shelf full of them at their desks.

Where on earth do you work? Everyplace I've ever worked (over the last 15-20 years), people constantly close their doors and read.

Door? Wow, I just wish I had my cubicle walls back again.
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