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Cisco Said to Be Cited for Bias Against U.S. Workers

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Re: Cisco Said to Be Cited for Bias Against U.S. Workers

#141

Post by untog »

toast_coder wrote: post #81
uissna wrote: post #10

This is an open secret in tech. Visa holders have less job offers to negotiate with, less job mobility, and consequently get paid less. Companies preferentially hire them over Americans. Further, the recent actions making harder for "body shops" like Infosys are actually helping big tech companies win more visa lotteries. This means the recent action that was supposed to help American workers, is actually causing the…

You think this only effects IT? You think salary negotiations are somehow immune to those same price pressures when we are dealing with the ppl who mow lawns, pick produce, and clean bathrooms?

The OP seems to be talking specifically about the H1B visa, which is for speciality occupations. Produce pickers need not apply.

Re: Cisco Said to Be Cited for Bias Against U.S. Workers

#142

Post by refurb »

amaccuish wrote: post #66
ekianjo wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So are you fine if Cisco relocates most of their operations in India for example? Because companies can move, and have done so many times in the past 30 years. That is basically what such restrictions lead to.

>So are you fine if Cisco relocates most of their operations in India for example That is almost always threatened and almost always never happens. As toomuchtodo suggests, this lassez-faire culture with business needs to stop. Every year it's a different scandal, we need to stop tip-toeing around business. They rely on a nation's education system, transport, internet infrastructure etc, they didn't come from nothing…

That is almost always threatened and almost always never happens.

What? There has been a huge amount of offshoring in the past few decades. Not sure you can say it never happens.

Re: Cisco Said to Be Cited for Bias Against U.S. Workers

#143

Post by Aloha »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #114
baddox wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How so? Because citizens can vote? Because citizens have some legal protections that don't apply to non-citizens? Doesn't that mean that non-citizens actually have more of a stake in the competence and behavior of the government because they have much more to lose from certain government actions?

I'm unsure how we can argue this any further. You're arguing "what supports the existence of the concept of citizenship and a sovereign nation". That is the legal framework (across nations) we've agreed upon.

Culture, history, belief in a common set of values or traditions - Tradition.

People ought to have a vested interest in the place they work, and live. I know of no better way to do that than citizenship.

Re: Cisco Said to Be Cited for Bias Against U.S. Workers

#144

Post by Aloha »

fjsolwmv wrote: post #23
lvspiff wrote: post #9

Sad thing is - if this is going on at Cisco imagine what goes on in the farm fields, the restaurants, the hotels, and the rest of the lowest paying jobs in this country. If it takes YEARS to build a case against giant company how many little guys are getting away with it on a daily basis?

In the farms, even basic laws banning hiring illegal immigrants get immediately blocked by a coalition of pro-immigration activists and big companies in the industry.

Without illegal immigrants crops would literally rot in the fields. I don't like illegal immigration, I'd rather there be a easy legal program to allow temporary workers, but there isn't, and I like eating.

Re: Cisco Said to Be Cited for Bias Against U.S. Workers

#145

Post by Aloha »

cc-d wrote: post #87
jeremyjh wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no need for an artificial cap, just make it a bidding system. The companies bid for how many workers at salary $X. Highest bids are awarded the visas. Problem solved.

This may work for tech, but I'm guessing there are quite a few other industries with low volumes of h1b applicants/workers which could utilize a "bidding system" to hire well below market rate due to decreased demand when compared to tech. $150k cap across the board ensures that all industries are kept honest. A bidding system can be added on top of that, if needed, but this extremely simple fix would ensure that the…

better idea - just make it 25-50% above prevailing wage for that kind of work.

Re: Cisco Said to Be Cited for Bias Against U.S. Workers

#147

Post by sush99 »

WalterSear wrote: post #130

When I was at Juniper Networks, Indian managers would routinely hire Indian employees on H1, underpay them to make them look competitive compared to US employees, and then pay them an additional salary through the Indian office, hiding this from the other departments, and the 'white' people.

Any proof to this?

Re: Cisco Said to Be Cited for Bias Against U.S. Workers

#148

Post by rmrfrmrf »

briandear wrote: post #103
kevin_b_er wrote: post #21

Corporate greed at its finest. The goal was to hire employees at lower wages and who couldn't just up and leave for another company next door so easily. This combined gets them workers who aren't allowed to negotiate and who are cheaper than normal workers. When driven only by greed, all methods to get more money are always acceptable... unless you are caught.

That’s not greed, that’s smart business. Why would you pay more for something if you didn’t have to? Is it greedy to take advantage of a sale on fruit at the grocery store rather than paying full price? The problem is visa law, not companies following that law.

Might be a controversial opinion, but I think we as humans have lost sight of the ball when we start letting capitalism drive ethics.

Re: Cisco Said to Be Cited for Bias Against U.S. Workers

#149

Post by WalterSear »

sush99 wrote: post #147
WalterSear wrote: post #130

When I was at Juniper Networks, Indian managers would routinely hire Indian employees on H1, underpay them to make them look competitive compared to US employees, and then pay them an additional salary through the Indian office, hiding this from the other departments, and the 'white' people.

Any proof to this?

Eyewitness testimony.

Re: Cisco Said to Be Cited for Bias Against U.S. Workers

#150

Post by closeparen »

ImNotBeingADick wrote: post #97
imbusy111 wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You seem to be delusional thinking that there is such a thing as an American. USA is the land of immigrants and as long as the best people come to US, it is the place to be. Ban the immigrants and the country loses its edge.

... Wouldn't you think that jobs should go to American citizens, before out sourcing and bringing everyones wages down?

Why would American citizenship be an indicator of deservingness?

> everyones

Why aren't foreigners in the category of "everyone"?

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