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The Billionaires and The Guru: How an Indian Family Burned Through $2B

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Re: The Billionaires and The Guru: How an Indian Family Burned Through $2B

#91

Post by alasdair_ »

atlantic wrote: post #81
test001only wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Aggregate political will is a feature of democracy. The fact that any single person on his/her own wish cannot make a big impact change is how a democracy is designed to work. For a democracy to work people need to take active part in the political process including things like consensus building. Changes start at grassroot level and is usually localised. You would have more impact at your constituency level than at…

That's the myth of democracy, yes. Glad to see there are still a few true believers. But in practice, 1/10^9 is the same as zero.

>But in practice, 1/10^9 is the same as zero

Sadly, it's not even that - we don't have a popular vote, so not all votes have the same weight :(

Re: The Billionaires and The Guru: How an Indian Family Burned Through $2B

#92

Post by dragonwriter »

alasdair_ wrote: post #91
atlantic wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's the myth of democracy, yes. Glad to see there are still a few true believers. But in practice, 1/10^9 is the same as zero.

>But in practice, 1/10^9 is the same as zero Sadly, it's not even that - we don't have a popular vote, so not all votes have the same weight :(

> Sadly, it's not even that - we don't have a popular vote, so not all votes have the same weight

The vast majority of elective public offices in the US are directly elected by popular vote.

Re: The Billionaires and The Guru: How an Indian Family Burned Through $2B

#93

Post by alasdair_ »

sokoloff wrote: post #71
mcny wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is not illegal and even if it were it does not, in any lawful society, justify extrajudicial torture and/or murder.

OK, then what is your objection to the police taking a sample of the meat to the lab for testing?! It seems no different than taking any other piece of crime scene or crime-related evidence to me.

> OK, then what is your objection to the police taking a sample of the meat to the lab for testing?! >It seems no different than taking any other piece of crime scene or crime-related evidence to me.

It has the same vibe as checking the skirt length of a rape victim, or checking into the sexual history of someone beaten up for being gay, just to be sure they really were gay.

Re: The Billionaires and The Guru: How an Indian Family Burned Through $2B

#94

Post by neuromantik8086 »

sn41 wrote: post #40
hesarenu wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That does not say much.

Sure, you're right. My original point was to point out the hypocrisy of the government policy. But you have raised a related point about IITs. Aside from being underfunded (in comparison to global standards) there are systemic issues with IITs which make it underperform in research - first, they were designed as undergraduate institutes. The administrators constantly harangue, and block the ways of the colleagues who…

> Faculty must be allowed to do research 90 % of the time

God no. This is exactly the problem that most undergraduate campuses in the US are grappling with right now. Pedagogy (you know, the purported reason for the existence of universities when they were first established) is taking a backseat to research, with students not deriving nearly the value from college that they should be. Most newly-minted PhD candidates want to create rigorous research programs, even at small liberal arts colleges, much to the detriment of those who matriculate (and who consequently accumulate ludicrous amounts of debt).

It would be much better for academia to have an honest conversation with itself and note that some people want to teach while others want to do research, and send the research-inclined to non-teaching institutes like IAS, LLNL, the Broad Institute, etc and the teaching-inclined to work with undergraduates. The outliers who fall in the middle of the Venn diagram can choose for themselves which direction they want to go.

It also would help if workshops to develop pedagogical techniques weren't almost universally optional for grad students and the ones who do engage in them get looks for wanting to do them instead of doing research... this may be just an impression on my part, but I really felt like grad students I've encountered who prioritize teaching over publications get marginalized.

Re: The Billionaires and The Guru: How an Indian Family Burned Through $2B

#95

Post by sbmthakur »

mcny wrote: post #29
sandGorgon wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

there's no better time to come back. Do come. Its about what you can create in the world's largest democracy. Are we the only country with constitutionally guaranteed Right to Privacy ? come and build. Oh and that goes for everyone else too. We have a lot of American, Brit and Chinese founders building successful startups in India.

The difference is that the Americans, the Brits, and the Chinese can leave any time they want. I've talked to a few Indians and that tried to defend the mob that killed some guy for allegedly coming beef. More embarrassingly, they defended the police for taking a sample of the questionable meat for lab testing to check if it was beef. I can forgive the mob. Maybe things get heated and people lose their minds. They sh…

Defending lynching(done for whatever reason) is sickening.

However, I don't see how that is a reason for someone "not coming back to India". Not all people from the majority religion have ganged up and decided to lynch Muslims.

India has a population of more than 1.3 billion and it is severely under-policed. This leads to several miscreants doing all sorts of bad stuff.

> Democracy doesn't mean anything without rights of the minority. Not because you like Muslims. You can totally hate Muslims and still support basic decency of life for people of that faith.

What is the rationale behind this argument? The Indian state doesn't discriminate against people based on their religion or color. I am not denying criminal acts against Muslims. Investigations are on in these cases and people are being punished as per the law.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-43496017

Re: The Billionaires and The Guru: How an Indian Family Burned Through $2B

#96

Post by legolas2412 »

alasdair_ wrote: post #68
test001only wrote: post #38

It is interesting to see Indians talking of themselves and India as a separate entity. Now, I am fine with people moving out of the country and I can understand the appeal. A lot of problems in India have been long solved in the west and there are problems which are unique to India. But it is hypocritical to blame the ills on "India" as if it exists without it's people. Citizens make a country and they are equally re…

>It is interesting to see Indians talking of themselves and India as a separate entity. Apropos of that, I have an Indian acquaintance who is an activist, focusing on women's rights and poverty. She's told a couple of stories stories about going into tiny, remote villages in India and telling people about their basic rights under the law, only to be asked "what is India?" and having to explain that the place these pe…

Probably because India is the name in english. It is called Bharat in Hindi, other names in other vernaculars.

Re: The Billionaires and The Guru: How an Indian Family Burned Through $2B

#97

Post by eevilspock »

atlantic wrote: post #82
eevilspock wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah colonialism and Britain's control, exploitation and distortion of India over 300 years has nothing to do with India's problems. "The West" "solved" a bunch of its problems as it created problems in the rest of the world.

Empires have been doing what empires do since the beginning of recorded history. The West is no exception in this respect.

1. I was responding to test001only putting the blame on Indians.

2. The West claims to be enlightened and progressive. Essentially having a manifest moral destiny.

3. Men have been sexist through most if not all of recorded history, treating women as lessor beings if not property. Does that excuse today's men?

Re: The Billionaires and The Guru: How an Indian Family Burned Through $2B

#98

Post by legolas2412 »

mcny wrote: post #64
sokoloff wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

WRT motive, the fact of whether it was or wasn't beef when introduced into evidence may prove to be exculpatory (if the finders of fact decide that it was justified) or may prove to be further damning (if the finders of facts decide that it was pre-meditated). I wouldn't want the police on the scene to be in the business of deciding what possibly relevant facts in the case will prove to be crucial. Collect, catalog,…

It is not illegal and even if it were it does not, in any lawful society, justify extrajudicial torture and/or murder.

I don't support vigilantes and neither do I agree with the imposition of religious views in violation of civil rights.

That being said, you are wrong. It was illegal.

Lynching happened in UP. And sale, transport, and slaughter of beef is illegal there.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2015_Dadri_mob_lynching https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cattle_slaughter_in_India#Utta...

The police should take the samples for analysis as they did. It is the procedure I expect from them in this case.

If a bank robber was killed during a bank heist, you would still investigate who planned the robbery wouldn't you?

Re: The Billionaires and The Guru: How an Indian Family Burned Through $2B

#99

Post by legolas2412 »

alasdair_ wrote: post #93
sokoloff wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OK, then what is your objection to the police taking a sample of the meat to the lab for testing?! It seems no different than taking any other piece of crime scene or crime-related evidence to me.

> OK, then what is your objection to the police taking a sample of the meat to the lab for testing?! >It seems no different than taking any other piece of crime scene or crime-related evidence to me. It has the same vibe as checking the skirt length of a rape victim, or checking into the sexual history of someone beaten up for being gay, just to be sure they really were gay.

Wearing short skirts is not a crime, but slaughtering cows, transporting and selling beef is (in that state).

I do not agree with the laws, but the police should dutifully follow the laws.

Re: The Billionaires and The Guru: How an Indian Family Burned Through $2B

#100

Post by rconti »

xaranke wrote: post #4

As someone who left India for the US, this article gives me pause as to whether things have actually changed in shining New India or if it's just a facade with air conditioning. More specifically, I'd like to move back at some point and I'm not sure if I ever should.

I think another hard thing is that your expectations will change the longer you live in the US (and as things change in the US as well), so what would have been a remarkable improvement to you before might be "not enough".

Then again, one would expect that India is improving far more quickly than the US.

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