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Australians who won't unlock their phones could face ten years in jail

nakedsecurity.sophos.com

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Re: Australians who won't unlock their phones could face ten years in jail

#91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Contempt of court is not a life sentence. It ends the moment the defendant complies. Whereas a sentence for a "10 years in jail for not revealing password" charge would not be vacated when you decide to reveal the password.

What if the defendant has genuinely forgotten the password?

That could be bad, if the court believes that they're lying.

Re: Australians who won't unlock their phones could face ten years in jail

#92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're dramatically over-simplifying by using one example to claim it's law. That is not the US law, that's one individual instance. In fact it's unsettled legal territory. The Supreme Court has yet to settle it, and they will very likely be the final word.

That one precedent sets the most reasonable expectation of what U.S. law means in practice, unless and until overturned.

Only in the 3rd Circuit; other jurisdictions aren't obliged to follow its precedent.

Re: Australians who won't unlock their phones could face ten years in jail

#93
post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree with that statement because they have fundamentally different purposes. Free speech affects my ability to improve society. Right to privacy affects my ability to cover my own ass.

Free speech in a country that goes authoritarian is very harmful for your career. People in power have connections, they can make it hard for you to make a living without even breaking the law, just asking the right people for a favor. Anonymity is one of the things that make people more likely to say what's need to be said. Without protection of privacy - very few people will exercise their free speech when things g…

Maybe these types of people would not have power if everyone knew who they really where.

That said I understand people who are afraid that loss of privacy would be asymmetric but I don't think that would happen. Celebrities and public figures will always have less privacy than everyone else.

Re: Australians who won't unlock their phones could face ten years in jail

#94
post #52
post #47

Has anyone created a mobile OS that has a feature where if a certain password is entered on the unlock screen that it boots up a dummy desktop while silently encrypting or erasing the phone in the background?

It doesn't seem so easy to do reasonably. Somebody can compare your call log/messages to data they got from your provider. It still seems like a nice idea, but it doesn't really give you plausible deniability.

I don't think the call and SMS log is what needs to be hidden, as those are so easily accessible that it would be foolish to use them for anything very sensitive. It would be to protect more sensitive things such as email accounts, encrypted messaging, photos, documents, etc.

Re: Australians who won't unlock their phones could face ten years in jail

#95
post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But it is possible to say that you have Truecrypt installed. Then the LEO just asks for the second password.

> Then the LEO just asks for the second password. But it's entirely _optional_ to use. They cannot prove there is a second password.

They're not dumb. You installed the thing you're claiming gives you plausible deniability -- it's a fair inference that you wanted just that so that you could hide something, ergo the court will just demand that password.

Which means you shouldn't install any such software unless you're going to have those hidden partitions and are willing to let LE have access.

Re: Australians who won't unlock their phones could face ten years in jail

#96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But it is possible to say that you have Truecrypt installed. Then the LEO just asks for the second password.

Which is why you have 10 passwords, only 1 of which has the important stuff on it. You are industiguisable from someone who has 9. What, are the police just going to keep you in jail? What if you really ARE innocent? Jail for life then, because they didn't find anything incriminating?

Free space management needs imply that at some point you must provably have all N passwords or that you're wasting some amount of space just to avoid that, but since that's dumb the fair inference is that you're not doing that, and that you have N passwords to reveal.

Re: Australians who won't unlock their phones could face ten years in jail

#97
It's evident citizens are not going to win the fight for privacy by trying to change policy. Voting has become nearly meaningless in the modern age when it comes to changing politics. Influencing businesses to do what's right is becoming more challenging too as this order shows they can just be forced to hand over data by authorities.

I don't want the "bad guys" getting away with their activities either, but I don't want some jackass in a volatile country to obtain my confidential data because the authorities are too incompetent to store it securely on their servers. It's just begging for identity theft and black-mail. Time and time again we've been shown that even the most sensitive data can't be secured properly (e.g. Equifax, Google, Yahoo, Anthem, NSA/CIA hacks and leaks).

I also don't want some corrupt cop having a bad day make up an absurdly false reason to go through my private life. It's bad enough with people getting drugs planted by corrupt cops; authorities just can't be trusted and there is no proper oversight to make sure they're acting ethically.

The only way to fight this is by developing tools to counteract these measures in a reasonably intelligent manner. Hidden multi-layer partitions, hidden "remote" hosts, encrypted decoys that show faux private content so it appears you're cooperating when real content is hidden, etc.

Re: Australians who won't unlock their phones could face ten years in jail

#98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The article mentions both child abusers and terrorists yet the laws will rarely be used for that. Mandatory metadata retention was also bought in for the same reasons and has barely appeared as evidence in any subsequent cases, despite >300,000 warrantless metadata requests last year, overseen by a handful of public servants behind closed doors, in a country of 25 million people. Another very concerning law is about…

Regarding your example of this person being forced into a mental institution, are you able to provide a source? I'm interested in learning more especially as I'm living in Australia, this is quite terrifying indeed.

I did a search for "Fiona Wilson Australia fixated" and got back a few articles, not familiar enough with AU news to determine what is tabloids and what is not. Please post if anyone finds something reputable.

Re: Australians who won't unlock their phones could face ten years in jail

#99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The article mentions both child abusers and terrorists yet the laws will rarely be used for that. Mandatory metadata retention was also bought in for the same reasons and has barely appeared as evidence in any subsequent cases, despite >300,000 warrantless metadata requests last year, overseen by a handful of public servants behind closed doors, in a country of 25 million people. Another very concerning law is about…

> she was then deemed a "fixated person", which involved incarceration without charge, being taken to a mental institution and forcibly injected with anti-psychotic drugs for months. Eventually a judge decided she could go home. All media coverage of it is banned in Australia until the trial is finished, which has been postponed at every hearing for over a year now Holy shit. Maybe I'll stop complaining about the US…

Yep, that's the entire point. It would be horrifying to have your name broadcast in connection to some heinous crime you didn't commit, but the alternative to broadcasting that is effectively secret trials. People should be able to view due process, they just need to withhold judgement until the facts come out in court.

Re: Australians who won't unlock their phones could face ten years in jail

#100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If LEO find you're using Truecrypt, do you think they'll not realize that you might have a hidden drive and ask for that password too??

Well, then you give them your second password, and it is fine, because you actually have 3 passwords. The police can't just keep saying "we didn't find anything, therefore you MUST have ANOTHER double secret password!". At that point you are indistinguishable from someone who is innocent.

The device is rated 1TB. Given all of the passwords you gave us we can account for .5TB and we cannot find a free-space map. Ergo there is at least one more password that you're not sharing with us.

Seriously, other people aren't dumb.

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