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NYU Makes Tuition Free for All Medical Students

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Re: NYU Makes Tuition Free for All Medical Students

#181

Post by pwdisswordfish2 »

agitator wrote: post #151
monocasa wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IDK. The same thought process led me to not being able to complete college due to financial reasons. Despite being emancipated, FAFSA still considers you a dependent until you're 24. I was told that only with documentation of leaving an abusive household would a dependency exception grant be applied. So according to FAFSA I was supposed to use all this money that I didn't have to pay for college. By 24 I had dropped…

I agree. Yes, it will cost a lot and yes we need to find a way to fund it, but giving all communities fair access to education is in everyone's best interest. Increasing the base level of education makes everyone a more intelligent, informed citizen and voter, and will have a positive impact on the progression of our country. I think it's a bad idea to be penny pinching in this regard. I also think everyone being edu…

Free but not compulsory, right? You don't need higher education for a lot of jobs and many people do not wish to attend college. I also think it's wrong to imply that people who haven't attended higher education can't "think for themselves". My 2 cents.

Re: NYU Makes Tuition Free for All Medical Students

#182

Post by WillPostForFood »

jeffreybaird wrote: post #174
WillPostForFood wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Under educated population is a disaster, but that problem starts about 12 years before college, in a different all public/free education system. Jamming more people through mediocre and worse college programs to get worthless degrees is a waste of time and money.

Why do you assume that degrees are "worthless?" How are you defining "worthless?" Based on the research, getting a degree significantly increases your earning potential. But I would argue that even if that wasn't the case and everyone got philosophy, literature, and history degrees, our country would be significantly better positioned globally. And I agree with your statement that the problem starts earlier. Although…

I’m referring to all the unemployed and underemployed college graduates complaining about the debt they are in. Simplify transferring the debt somewhere else isn’t fixing anything, it is just shifting the drain on society. College is highly useful for some people, and not others. We should do more to make sure it is available to those who would benefit, and offer different things for those who prefer or need trade skills.

Re: NYU Makes Tuition Free for All Medical Students

#183

Post by QML »

agitator wrote: post #151
monocasa wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IDK. The same thought process led me to not being able to complete college due to financial reasons. Despite being emancipated, FAFSA still considers you a dependent until you're 24. I was told that only with documentation of leaving an abusive household would a dependency exception grant be applied. So according to FAFSA I was supposed to use all this money that I didn't have to pay for college. By 24 I had dropped…

I agree. Yes, it will cost a lot and yes we need to find a way to fund it, but giving all communities fair access to education is in everyone's best interest. Increasing the base level of education makes everyone a more intelligent, informed citizen and voter, and will have a positive impact on the progression of our country. I think it's a bad idea to be penny pinching in this regard. I also think everyone being edu…

I agree with a lot of your points, but the way to increasing the base level of education isn’t through making all colleges free — it’s through investing in and making community colleges free.

Why? If we’re trying educate the entire populace instead of a few high achieving high schoolers, we should recognize that a majority of people can’t afford to up-end their lives, move far away, and spend 4 years getting a degree.

Community colleges, emphasis on the community term, would allow for people — local people — to educate themselves without drastically affecting their livelihoods. In this way, community colleges can also potentially act as job retraining facilities.

Note that I am slightly biased as a Californian.

Re: NYU Makes Tuition Free for All Medical Students

#184

Post by monocasa »

QML wrote: post #164
WillPostForFood wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All that for a worthless degree in antaractic penguin studies from Shady St Univ. You still graduate unemployed, unskilled, but instead of you paying the debt, someone else does. Also, with no skin in the game, I’m sure college will get even less serious.

I believe when most people say “make college free”, they’re referring to a “tuition free” education. There is still a housing cost, which is “skin in the game”.

Eh, my ideal would be like Europe's that gives you a stipend as well to cover room and board. Paying for housing is more than a full time job in a lot of places with universities (particularly the good ones), and ideally we'd want students to be focusing on their studies.

Re: NYU Makes Tuition Free for All Medical Students

#185

Post by WillPostForFood »

_emacsomancer_ wrote: post #169
WillPostForFood wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All that for a worthless degree in antaractic penguin studies from Shady St Univ. You still graduate unemployed, unskilled, but instead of you paying the debt, someone else does. Also, with no skin in the game, I’m sure college will get even less serious.

Then don't fund Shady St Uni. Put criteria in place for evaluating, and make sure the universities have skin in the game. (Also, not every degree that doesn't immediately result in you making $250,000/year is worthless. And students are pretty motivated already in pursuing degrees that they see jobs in. Even if your education is free, if you put in 4+ years into something that you can't do anything with, you're still…

Ok. Do that first and I might support it. But the guaranteed loans for everyone system of today has not only inflated costs, it supports a bunch of worthless crappy schools. Go look at the list of universities in the US, and find the bottom 100. They are as offensive and wasteful as a $10,000 toilet seat.

Re: NYU Makes Tuition Free for All Medical Students

#186

Post by thatfrenchguy »

WillPostForFood wrote: post #152
jeffreybaird wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Raise the income tax, create a VAT, kill the mortgage-interest tax deduction, add a Financial transaction tax, tax capital gains like normal income, stop subsidizing fossil fuel extraction, add a carbon tax, and lower the threshold for the inheritance tax and raise the percentage.

All that for a worthless degree in antaractic penguin studies from Shady St Univ. You still graduate unemployed, unskilled, but instead of you paying the debt, someone else does. Also, with no skin in the game, I’m sure college will get even less serious.

As we had seen from free education in most of Western Europe.

Re: NYU Makes Tuition Free for All Medical Students

#187

Post by _emacsomancer_ »

jmkb wrote: post #147
DoofusOfDeath wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> a wealthy Stanford alumni Grammar tip: In English, the word "alumnus" is typically declined as it would be in Latin. Especially amongst academics, I'd say. So if you're writing for that audience, the appropriate forms of "alumnus" are, I think, as follows [0]: "alumnus" - One male, or one person of unspecified sex. "alumna" - One female. "alumnae" - Multiple females. "alumni" - Multiple persons whose sex is all mal…

In my experience, most people simply use "alum" for the singular, "alums" for the plural. Dropping the n, even!

Presumably a combination of reanalysing "alumn-us", "alumn-i", etc. as "alum-nus", "alum-ni", etc. and a phonological preference/constraint against word-final /mnz/. And against /mn/ too: even English column is /ˈkɒləm/ and not /ˈkɒləmn/.

Re: NYU Makes Tuition Free for All Medical Students

#188

Post by _emacsomancer_ »

WillPostForFood wrote: post #185
_emacsomancer_ wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then don't fund Shady St Uni. Put criteria in place for evaluating, and make sure the universities have skin in the game. (Also, not every degree that doesn't immediately result in you making $250,000/year is worthless. And students are pretty motivated already in pursuing degrees that they see jobs in. Even if your education is free, if you put in 4+ years into something that you can't do anything with, you're still…

Ok. Do that first and I might support it. But the guaranteed loans for everyone system of today has not only inflated costs, it supports a bunch of worthless crappy schools. Go look at the list of universities in the US, and find the bottom 100. They are as offensive and wasteful as a $10,000 toilet seat.

I agree. But that's not a product of free education.

Re: NYU Makes Tuition Free for All Medical Students

#189

Post by benmw333 »

jeffreybaird wrote: post #178
benmw333 wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Wow! You are right! Nobody is entitled to anyone's labor! We should make sure we let the capitalists who use the labor of everyone around them to extract profits.

Nice. Got a bite. Clearly you view the world as a zero-sum game. That's not reality. Reality is - I need help to get something done. You and I talk about you helping me get something done. You and I agree to exchange X value for Y labor. You get something of value and I get something of value. Nobody forced either of us into the agreement... we both did so freely. Wow. So right! So simple! Me like freedom. Me go eat waffle.

Re: NYU Makes Tuition Free for All Medical Students

#190

Post by agitator »

pwdisswordfish2 wrote: post #181
agitator wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree. Yes, it will cost a lot and yes we need to find a way to fund it, but giving all communities fair access to education is in everyone's best interest. Increasing the base level of education makes everyone a more intelligent, informed citizen and voter, and will have a positive impact on the progression of our country. I think it's a bad idea to be penny pinching in this regard. I also think everyone being edu…

Free but not compulsory, right? You don't need higher education for a lot of jobs and many people do not wish to attend college. I also think it's wrong to imply that people who haven't attended higher education can't "think for themselves". My 2 cents.

100% agree, and not the point i'm making.

I'm saying it will increase the average level of individual thinking, but not saying that it's a requirement. I'm simply saying those people that forgo schooling because it's not economically feasible for them, will have the ability to do so and thus one large factor in keeping people down is eliminated.

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