Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

The Akrasia Effect: Why We Don’t Follow Through on What We Set Out to Do

jamesclear.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

71–80 of 157 posts

Re: The Akrasia Effect: Why We Don’t Follow Through on What We Set Out to Do

#71

Post by whack »

I have a pet theory than the reason people procrastinate, is because they don't concretely identify their future selves, as being the "same person" as their present self. Rather, they view their future self as an abstract person, more akin to a friend, than self. This level of relatedness varies with time as well. People identify very strongly with their future self from tomorrow, perhaps akin to their best friend. But they identify their future self from years/decades later, more akin to a distant cousin.

From this perspective, procrastination becomes analogous to selfishness. A very "altruistic" person would prioritize their future self to the same extent that they would prioritize their present desires. Perhaps even more so. Whereas a more "self centered" person sees their future self as a stranger whose desires are inconsequential to their present selves.

What would be really interesting to consider, is the correlation between "future altruism" and traditional altruism. One can imagine these two being completely uncorrelated, the same way a racist person can be completely uncaring towards other races whilst still being altruistic within their own race. But if there is indeed a stronger correlation, that would be a very interesting finding.

Re: The Akrasia Effect: Why We Don’t Follow Through on What We Set Out to Do

#72

Post by WhompingWindows »

whack wrote: post #71

I have a pet theory than the reason people procrastinate, is because they don't concretely identify their future selves, as being the "same person" as their present self. Rather, they view their future self as an abstract person, more akin to a friend, than self. This level of relatedness varies with time as well. People identify very strongly with their future self from tomorrow, perhaps akin to their best friend. B…

I doubt it's that complex. Occam's razor suggests a simpler explanation: there is discomfort in starting a task, therefore people delay starting that task. It's a pain avoidance strategy, which sounds much more likely than some self-referential, future-self theory.

Re: The Akrasia Effect: Why We Don’t Follow Through on What We Set Out to Do

#73

Post by mistermann »

bernardino wrote: post #62
ckosidows wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel that when I eliminate forms of entertainment from my life or impose limits I can often go too far and then swing back in the other direction. Your comment seems to indicate you manage your vices similarly. Do you also recede back into them or has this not been a problem for you?

No, I definitely resort back to entertainment every once in a while. I wouldn't go as far to call it a problem though. I suppose entertainment in low doses is fine but entertainment as the main staple of our diet is no good. In terms of deep work, I think it's important to see the side of spectrum of how entertainment only exists to stimulate a neurological response. For instance, think about always refreshing a site…

I once looked into reading some of DFW's books after reading some essays related to some of his ideas, but something along the way stopped me, I think it might have been that I didn't get the sense that his books and the ideas within were as directly pragmatic as the essays I'd read, but were instead far more abstract. Do you think this assessment was wrong, and if so could anyone recommend a big that doesn't use a metaphorical approach too much?

And I will also piggyback another question I had with respect to this article: does anyone know a "pro-sumer" level router that has awesome access control capabilities, so I can easily blacklist a collection of websites? I know there are some alternatives for the desktop, but I didn't find anything I liked, and I want blockage at the router level, but there's no way I'm going to get into standing up a pi-hole box or anything remotely as complicated as that.

Re: The Akrasia Effect: Why We Don’t Follow Through on What We Set Out to Do

#74

Post by swaggyBoatswain »

olooney wrote: post #3

"Reduce friction to start" is a huge one for me. Especially if "starting" is a bunch of busywork like writing a Dockerfile, initializing a git repo, creating package metadata files, etc. I've found it helpful to just dive in and start writing the "fun" part first and turn it into a "real" project later. Usually after an hour of coding or less I feel I've created something of value that I want to save and reuse so the…

That has always been the biggest turn off for me as well. Setting up everything takes too long and I like just jumping straight into the project.

My gym is right behind my desk, I have 0 excuses to workout almost everyday

Re: The Akrasia Effect: Why We Don’t Follow Through on What We Set Out to Do

#75

Post by JamesBarney »

whack wrote: post #71

I have a pet theory than the reason people procrastinate, is because they don't concretely identify their future selves, as being the "same person" as their present self. Rather, they view their future self as an abstract person, more akin to a friend, than self. This level of relatedness varies with time as well. People identify very strongly with their future self from tomorrow, perhaps akin to their best friend. B…

I've heard of one technique to fight akrasia which relies on your theory.

It's an exercise where you contemplate you future self as a friend, whose is immediately benefits from your actions. So if you're trying to not eat an extra serving of cake you imagine your future self as a friend who gets fat when you eat that extra serving.

Re: The Akrasia Effect: Why We Don’t Follow Through on What We Set Out to Do

#76

Post by ErikAugust »

whack wrote: post #71

I have a pet theory than the reason people procrastinate, is because they don't concretely identify their future selves, as being the "same person" as their present self. Rather, they view their future self as an abstract person, more akin to a friend, than self. This level of relatedness varies with time as well. People identify very strongly with their future self from tomorrow, perhaps akin to their best friend. B…

Related philosophical work: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reasons_and_Persons

Reasons and Persons by Derek Parfit

Re: The Akrasia Effect: Why We Don’t Follow Through on What We Set Out to Do

#77

Post by lihaciudaniel »

mroll wrote: post #14
beat wrote: post #10

Useful things for those in the struggle... Deep Work , by Cal Newport. An excellent book on how to work on really big ideas/projects effectively, without losing your humanity in the process. This is a must-read for anyone serious about work. Pomodoro Technique. This is well-documented with lots of apps and tools online, but it's pretty simple. Set a 25 minute timer. Work, without interruption, for 25 minutes. When th…

Any programmers here use pomodoro? I expect 25 minute interruptions would do more harm than good for my focus when writing code, especially the continuous expectation that I will be interrupted. I don’t have a pressing interest in finding productivity tips, just curious to hear about programmers who have tried this technique

One advice from deep work was about embracing boredom. Like that was hell to survive. Usually boredom makes me lazier.

Re: The Akrasia Effect: Why We Don’t Follow Through on What We Set Out to Do

#78

Post by ckosidows »

mistermann wrote: post #73
bernardino wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, I definitely resort back to entertainment every once in a while. I wouldn't go as far to call it a problem though. I suppose entertainment in low doses is fine but entertainment as the main staple of our diet is no good. In terms of deep work, I think it's important to see the side of spectrum of how entertainment only exists to stimulate a neurological response. For instance, think about always refreshing a site…

I once looked into reading some of DFW's books after reading some essays related to some of his ideas, but something along the way stopped me, I think it might have been that I didn't get the sense that his books and the ideas within were as directly pragmatic as the essays I'd read, but were instead far more abstract. Do you think this assessment was wrong, and if so could anyone recommend a big that doesn't use a m…

I'm pretty sure most Netgear routers have OpenDNS interactions that you can use to block domains. At least my Nighthawk did.

Otherwise I think you can pay for an OpenDNS account.

Re: The Akrasia Effect: Why We Don’t Follow Through on What We Set Out to Do

#79

Post by joveian »

whack wrote: post #71

I have a pet theory than the reason people procrastinate, is because they don't concretely identify their future selves, as being the "same person" as their present self. Rather, they view their future self as an abstract person, more akin to a friend, than self. This level of relatedness varies with time as well. People identify very strongly with their future self from tomorrow, perhaps akin to their best friend. B…

IMO, you are suggesting way more thought than is actually going on in most cases. I think you are right about not identifying with future selves being part of the issue, but I think it is usually just memory, at least when talking about following through with a plan decided previously with significant deliberation. When considering plans in depth we do think about the future and what would be better, but in the moment of making decisions we are usualy involved in something else. I also don't think the article is right that it is usually preferring immediate gratification over long term benefits, but just that doing something towards the previous plan is an intrusion into whatever else we happen to be doing at the time and an interruption of focus or more immediate plans. We then only consider the previous plan superficially and are quick to accept some potential workaround to needing to work on it now (that is, it isn't that we are discounting our future but just not really considering it at all). I've found it helpful to try to notice if something is a potentially significant change to a previous plan and get out of the flow of whatever I am doing and consider it in more depth before actually making a change. Just getting out of the flow briefly when making the decision is enough to actually consider the future and make a good decision about following the previous plan or changing it.

Re: The Akrasia Effect: Why We Don’t Follow Through on What We Set Out to Do

#80

Post by tunesmith »

The existence of akrasia is one of those things that many people accept as reasonable, but if truly adopted as an axiom and reasoned from in a consistent manner, would lead to far different conclusions than we've adopted as a society.

https://www.vox.com/the-big-idea/2018/3/5/17080470/addiction...

Post reply on HN