Why you should, and shouldn’t, join a startup • Hacker News Board

Re: Why you should, and shouldn’t, join a startup

#121

Post by scarface74 » Wed, Aug 15, 2018, 5:28 PM UTC

paulie_a wrote: post #43

colechristensen wrote: post #22

>But when you compare it to the defined structure of an established company, it just doesn’t compare. Big companies have employee onboarding, management training, goal setting they’ve been doing for years — all of the things that give people guidance and mentorship on what they need to do to be successful. Goal setting, training, onboarding... these are processes, process doesn't make good management. The problems wi…

A good manager is also actively coaching their employees too. Training is important, but there is a distinct difference between the two.

In 20+ years at 7 companies with 10 managers, I’ve only been “coached” by one and that was 20 years into my career as the software architect.

Part of the problem was that I came into my first role as the only developer and I was responsible for building a fairly complex system from scratch. I then left and spent another 9 years at another company where I became an “expert beginner”. (https://daedtech.com/how-developers-stop-learning-rise-of-th...).

10 years and five jobs later, I have a manager who is technical sound, keeps up with the latest functionality of the cloud platform we are using, and can give good suggestions about what areas I should research to implement something, but I still have to do the nitty gritty details. I actually enjoy that from a manager.

Re: Why you should, and shouldn’t, join a startup

#122

Post by coaxial » Wed, Aug 15, 2018, 6:24 PM UTC

tlb wrote: post #19

gkoberger wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it depends on your definition of stability. Megacorp: The company won't disappear overnight, but you might get tossed around different positions and have projects you've spent a year on shut down out of nowhere. Startup: The company itself may shut down, but in the meantime everything is more focused and transparent.

In some sense the startup is lower cognitive load, because everything is great until it all implodes and then you look for a new startup. A punctuated equilibrium. At a megacorp, everything is vaguely doomed all the time, but never so clearly doomed that it's obvious when to make a move, and you spend a lot of time reading political tea leaves so as not to end up on the wrong project. The worst thing that most big co…

Haha, nicely said. I'll add reading political tea leaves to my skills.

Re: Why you should, and shouldn’t, join a startup

#123

Post by therealdrag0 » Wed, Aug 15, 2018, 7:06 PM UTC

jinonoel wrote: post #79

"Why join a startup #1: Acccess to jobs you're unqualified for" Had a good laugh at this, because it's completely true in my case. 7 years ago became the "data scientist" at a 4-person startup before I even knew what a data scientist actually does. Parlayed that into further data science jobs at somewhat bigger startups. Now I'm Head of Data Science at a stable traditional tech company making good money and this like…

Happens at other companies too. I have a friend who studied and worked only in EE, then got a job at Microsoft doing data-analytic focused work.

I had only done BE work, then at mid-sized-co I started taking front-end work for fun, and did that full time for 4 months. My work was appreciated even though I had no FE experience.

Big companies might care more about qualifications, but they can also float longer ramp-up times if you're not qualified.

Re: Why you should, and shouldn’t, join a startup

#124

Post by alexchantavy » Wed, Aug 15, 2018, 8:26 PM UTC

ajdlinux wrote: post #75

leetcrew wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

ah okay, I always sort of imagined it would be like that in SF. I live in a metro area that is not as tech-oriented. when I tell people I'm a software engineer at parties, the only thing they find impressive is that I actually have a full-time job.

I live in a public service town that's far more educated than the average city, a huge IT presence but it's mostly boring enterprise IT. Hard for "systems programmer" to stand up next to "diplomat" or "international anti-people-trafficking lawyer" in terms of party cred.

DC?

Re: Why you should, and shouldn’t, join a startup

#125

Post by retsibsi » Thu, Aug 16, 2018, 3:46 AM UTC

james1071 wrote: post #119

retsibsi wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I dunno, I know a lot of 'compliments' are nothing of the sort, but I can see this one being well-intended. It's not actually saying anything bad about the target, just awkwardly pointing out that they don't really fit a negative stereotype. And because 'socialness' isn't a quality where more is always better, it doesn't have quite the same damning-with-faint-praise vibe as it would if it were about, say, intelligenc…

Pointing out that someone does not really fit a negative stereotype will ussally not be perceived as a positive. I said usually, because it is possible to convey different meanings by tone of voice and other non-verbal means. But, based on the words alone, it will not be interpreted positively.

> Pointing out that someone does not really fit a negative stereotype will ussally not be perceived as a positive.

Agreed, I just think this is relatively likely to be one of the exceptions, or at least to be genuinely well-intended. Partly because it's not so likely to seem like damning with faint praise, and partly because the stereotype itself is less deeply offensive than e.g. racism.

(Especially if the trait in question is something like sociability, rather than social skills. If someone says they find me less introverted than they expected based on my profession, it's hard to take much offense at that. I think calling someone 'very social' is a bit ambiguous, but I lean toward interpreting it this way.)

Re: Why you should, and shouldn’t, join a startup

#126

Post by _Microft » Thu, Aug 16, 2018, 1:01 PM UTC

tribesman wrote: post #108

I love working at a startup, there is simply no cap on number of hours i can work. I can meet any other employee without any appointment. I can try my hands on accounting and legals. Go meet customers and give them the demo when i don't feel like working. I can collect cash from customers, take a photo of the cash and send it to boss where he sends me a thumbs up emoji. I often bring kids of my boss or colleagues fro…

.

Re: Why you should, and shouldn’t, join a startup

#127

Post by ajdlinux » Thu, Aug 16, 2018, 2:03 PM UTC

alexchantavy wrote: post #124

ajdlinux wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I live in a public service town that's far more educated than the average city, a huge IT presence but it's mostly boring enterprise IT. Hard for "systems programmer" to stand up next to "diplomat" or "international anti-people-trafficking lawyer" in terms of party cred.

DC?

CBR.

Re: Why you should, and shouldn’t, join a startup

#128

Post by nikhilkalegregg » Mon, Aug 20, 2018, 3:07 PM UTC

join a startup if you are a founding partner, believe in the product, have or believe in some vision or value that you can add to a product, and if you get along with the people (and are ideally around the same age as the main founders). Otherwise, in my opinion, do not join that theoretical startup--and start your own project.

Re: Why you should, and shouldn’t, join a startup

#129

Post by nikhilkalegregg » Tue, Aug 21, 2018, 4:53 PM UTC

nikhilkalegregg wrote: post #128

join a startup if you are a founding partner, believe in the product, have or believe in some vision or value that you can add to a product, and if you get along with the people (and are ideally around the same age as the main founders). Otherwise, in my opinion, do not join that theoretical startup--and start your own project.

also id add--regarding picking partners--one thing to be aware of is how your partner treats others--as nice as he/she treats you initially (whilst trying to recruit you) keep an eye on how he/she treats others he is not trying to recruit, because at the end of the day, that will ultimately determine how he/she will treat you. I overlooked these red flags to my detriment--and as soon as our company got required my CEO (who did next to nothing) sold our company's IP (which I as the CTO and only software engineer wrote alone) and cut me out --leaving me with nothing except the distinction of having sold a startup--while he pocketed all the profits, earned that distinction and went to business school (with all the other twats who train to do the same thing). For all the technical founders out there, do not join a business founder without vetting him/her in a variety of situations and trust his/her heart with your destiny.