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YC China and Qi Lu

blog.ycombinator.com

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Re: YC China and Qi Lu

#211

Post by omarforgotpwd »

scandox wrote: post #205
omarforgotpwd wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are a billion MORE people in China than in the US. There is enormous industry and innovation there. China's government is terrible but that is their issue to resolve. All we can do is speak out, but refusing to do business hurts Chinese and American people far more than it hurts the Chinese government. Our government kills many innocent people accidentally as part of the normal course of war, but we consider it…

I'm sure that some more fully articulated and sophisticated version of what you've said forms the basis of YC's decision to continue pragmatically pursuing its goal of being big and important (and incidentally making lots of money).

What, I'm not sophisticated and articulate at 3 AM? ;)

Re: YC China and Qi Lu

#212

Post by scandox »

omarforgotpwd wrote: post #211
scandox wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sure that some more fully articulated and sophisticated version of what you've said forms the basis of YC's decision to continue pragmatically pursuing its goal of being big and important (and incidentally making lots of money).

What, I'm not sophisticated and articulate at 3 AM? ;)

They've just had a hell of a long time to polish their excuses :)

Re: YC China and Qi Lu

#213

Post by enwa »

scandox wrote: post #205
omarforgotpwd wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are a billion MORE people in China than in the US. There is enormous industry and innovation there. China's government is terrible but that is their issue to resolve. All we can do is speak out, but refusing to do business hurts Chinese and American people far more than it hurts the Chinese government. Our government kills many innocent people accidentally as part of the normal course of war, but we consider it…

I'm sure that some more fully articulated and sophisticated version of what you've said forms the basis of YC's decision to continue pragmatically pursuing its goal of being big and important (and incidentally making lots of money).

That is very unlikely. When you start or own businesses in China you largely give up the right to criticize the Chinese government. Not only because you have to deal with the Chinese government, but because you won't have any credibility left at home. You can't on the one hand argue that the Chinese government is oppressive and on the other that it is practical to change peoples minds.

Re: YC China and Qi Lu

#214

Post by kryptiskt »

gdsdfe wrote: post #35

Hahaha people talking about ethics are silly ... This is business in a market, potentially, at least 3x bigger than the current biggest market! Are you nuts? Everybody's gonna do business in China! Everybody! In some form or shape.

The rest of the world is big enough for me.

Re: YC China and Qi Lu

#215

Post by vasco »

omarforgotpwd wrote: post #203
google_censors wrote: post #192

It's amazing that a company that Paul Graham co-founded is getting into bed with an authoritarian government notorious for its human rights abuses. To succeed in China you can't go against the government. So is he going to be pushing as hard for political change in China as he is in the US, or will he remain silent as his company reaps the profits?

There are a billion MORE people in China than in the US. There is enormous industry and innovation there. China's government is terrible but that is their issue to resolve. All we can do is speak out, but refusing to do business hurts Chinese and American people far more than it hurts the Chinese government. Our government kills many innocent people accidentally as part of the normal course of war, but we consider it…

One accidentally breaks an egg. One doesn't "accidentally" kill innocent people because they "accidentally" launched a missile to an area where civilians are.

Re: YC China and Qi Lu

#216

Post by thiago_fm »

google_censors wrote: post #192

It's amazing that a company that Paul Graham co-founded is getting into bed with an authoritarian government notorious for its human rights abuses. To succeed in China you can't go against the government. So is he going to be pushing as hard for political change in China as he is in the US, or will he remain silent as his company reaps the profits?

as If the US was any good

Re: YC China and Qi Lu

#217

Post by lettergram »

Gwaih1r wrote: post #153
fsloth wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1. It's not about empowering everyone on the planet, it's about creating companies which become billion dollar unicorns 2. The probability of Unicornism is directly related to the size of the market you can access. US is the biggest single market on the planet. 3. Accessibility of markets: While EU is the second largest single market [0] US companies have entered european markets just fine. On the other hand, to oper…

Are you sure nominal GDP is the right metric to be using to compare market size? By adjusted (PPP) GDP it's China, EU and then the US. Those billions can go a lot further in China and the EU than they can in the US. https://www.thebalance.com/world-s-largest-economy-3306044

Something to consider as well, is there is fairly wide spread consensus that China's GDP is significantly artificially inflated.

Re: YC China and Qi Lu

#218

Post by enwa »

omarforgotpwd wrote: post #203
google_censors wrote: post #192

It's amazing that a company that Paul Graham co-founded is getting into bed with an authoritarian government notorious for its human rights abuses. To succeed in China you can't go against the government. So is he going to be pushing as hard for political change in China as he is in the US, or will he remain silent as his company reaps the profits?

There are a billion MORE people in China than in the US. There is enormous industry and innovation there. China's government is terrible but that is their issue to resolve. All we can do is speak out, but refusing to do business hurts Chinese and American people far more than it hurts the Chinese government. Our government kills many innocent people accidentally as part of the normal course of war, but we consider it…

I think it is essentially the opposite. Speaking out does nothing since we, nor the Chinese, have any power to change the situation. All it does is makes the speaker feel good about their own situation.

The power we do have is to make our own choices. The Chinese might certainly have, what they think are, good reasons for doing what they are doing, but that doesn't mean you have to participate if you think you have better reasons for not doing so.

Chinese companies are largely forced to align with the Chinese government. US companies disagreeable behavior, including aligning themselves with the US and Chinese governments, are largely their own choosing. The reality is that Silicon Valley's moral compass is buried at the bottom of their own Superfund sites.

Re: YC China and Qi Lu

#219

Post by davidzweig »

telltruth wrote: post #88
seanmcdirmid wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mandarin isn't strictly necessary to live in China. Plenty of my laowai colleagues only knew a few words and got along just fine in a tier one Beijing, which admittedly is a bit behind Shanghai and Shenzhen. The only thing that really drove us out was the pollution (a huge problem in Beijing that is supposedly finally getting better). Given the US visa policy, as bad as it is, still attracts far more many foreigners…

> Mandarin isn't strictly necessary to live in China Basic question: what do you do in China for browsing, emails and maps? I suppose Google doesn't work there and all the local services would be in Mandarin, no? When I travel I use Google search, emails, maps extensively but I have no clue what would I do in China. Also FB and Twitter also likely won't be accessible. So how do I even keep touch with folks outside Ch…

Some options:

>> ExpressVPN worked well on windows, although flakey for me on Android.

>> Set up ShadowSocks on a server outside China.

>> Buy a SIM card in Hong Kong, they apparently maintain their unrestricted internet access even in the mainland.

Re: YC China and Qi Lu

#220

Post by vorg »

> YC has been very successful in the world by believing that hackers – not businesspeople – can build the biggest companies.

Virtually every non-technologist businessperson who becomes a manager in the IT industry will present themselves as a technologist. They will usually have some real technical people at their beck and call to help with the stuff they can't fake.

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