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Bullshit-sensitivity predicts prosocial behavior

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Re: Bullshit-sensitivity predicts prosocial behavior

#61

Post by malloryerik »

duopixel wrote: post #19

A simple self-experiment if you haven't read the paper, find which of these sentences are bullshit. Answer in order without reading further ahead, and don't go back to change your answers (as to replicate experimental conditions). * 1. A river cuts through a rock, not because of its power but it's persistence. 2. The hidden meaning transforms the abstract beauty. 3. The future elucidates irrational facts for the seek…

> 11. Imagined pain does not hurt less because it is imagined.

This statement confuses cause (some damage) and effect (pain) and so should be in the bullshit category, or else it's poorly written/translated.

An imagined cause may lead to real pain, for example if you believe you've been betrayed but you haven't. The pain is the same as if you had actually been betrayed, and in both cases that pain isn't imagined, it's a real mental, neurological phenomenon.

But the only pain that's imagined is pain that's not happening to us, like someone else's pain and future pain, and sorry but despite all sympathy and fear, yeah that does usually hurt a lot less.

Re: Bullshit-sensitivity predicts prosocial behavior

#62

Post by peteretep »

tabs_masterrace wrote: post #28

> Health and tolerance provides creativity for the future. This one is classified bullshit, although I think it makes at least somewhat sense.

Right. Also:

> 2. The hidden meaning transforms the abstract beauty.

Describes reading the description of an artwork at a Modern Art gallery pretty well

Re: Bullshit-sensitivity predicts prosocial behavior

#63

Post by alkonaut »

foldr wrote: post #58
duopixel wrote: post #19

A simple self-experiment if you haven't read the paper, find which of these sentences are bullshit. Answer in order without reading further ahead, and don't go back to change your answers (as to replicate experimental conditions). * 1. A river cuts through a rock, not because of its power but it's persistence. 2. The hidden meaning transforms the abstract beauty. 3. The future elucidates irrational facts for the seek…

>11. Imagined pain does not hurt less because it is imagined. I guess I can see how this might be classed as "not bullshit", but I don't see how it's profound at all. It just seems false to me. I agreed with all the other classifications. edit : I know complaining about downvotes is verboten here, but seriously, that's just my take on it. I'd be interested to hear an explanation of what the profound meaning is that I…

Perhaps because all pain is, in a sense, "imagined"?

Re: Bullshit-sensitivity predicts prosocial behavior

#64

Post by abbasaamer »

foldr wrote: post #58
duopixel wrote: post #19

A simple self-experiment if you haven't read the paper, find which of these sentences are bullshit. Answer in order without reading further ahead, and don't go back to change your answers (as to replicate experimental conditions). * 1. A river cuts through a rock, not because of its power but it's persistence. 2. The hidden meaning transforms the abstract beauty. 3. The future elucidates irrational facts for the seek…

>11. Imagined pain does not hurt less because it is imagined. I guess I can see how this might be classed as "not bullshit", but I don't see how it's profound at all. It just seems false to me. I agreed with all the other classifications. edit : I know complaining about downvotes is verboten here, but seriously, that's just my take on it. I'd be interested to hear an explanation of what the profound meaning is that I…

Imagine you are paranoid and you suspect someone is deceiving you. The reality of whether or not they are actually deceiving you does not have an impact on how much pain you feel.

Alternatively, someone with a mental condition that leads them to believe they are in pain would conceivably feel the same pain as someone who is actually being physically hurt.

Just my take on it.

Re: Bullshit-sensitivity predicts prosocial behavior

#65

Post by foldr »

alkonaut wrote: post #63
foldr wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>11. Imagined pain does not hurt less because it is imagined. I guess I can see how this might be classed as "not bullshit", but I don't see how it's profound at all. It just seems false to me. I agreed with all the other classifications. edit : I know complaining about downvotes is verboten here, but seriously, that's just my take on it. I'd be interested to hear an explanation of what the profound meaning is that I…

Perhaps because all pain is, in a sense, "imagined"?

I don't think so. The sentence seems to be accepting the distinction between imagined pain and real pain, and saying that the imaginary nature of the former does not cause it to hurt less than the latter (technically leaving open the possibility that it does hurt less for some other reason).

Also, we clearly can distinguish imaginary pain from real pain. For example, there's a difference between the real pain I feel if I stub my toe and the imaginary pain I "feel" if I imagine myself stubbing my toe.

Re: Bullshit-sensitivity predicts prosocial behavior

#66

Post by abbasaamer »

peteretep wrote: post #62
tabs_masterrace wrote: post #28

> Health and tolerance provides creativity for the future. This one is classified bullshit, although I think it makes at least somewhat sense.

Right. Also: > 2. The hidden meaning transforms the abstract beauty. Describes reading the description of an artwork at a Modern Art gallery pretty well

Does it? Where is the "transformation" happening? In mind of the viewer?

Re: Bullshit-sensitivity predicts prosocial behavior

#67

Post by foldr »

abbasaamer wrote: post #64
foldr wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>11. Imagined pain does not hurt less because it is imagined. I guess I can see how this might be classed as "not bullshit", but I don't see how it's profound at all. It just seems false to me. I agreed with all the other classifications. edit : I know complaining about downvotes is verboten here, but seriously, that's just my take on it. I'd be interested to hear an explanation of what the profound meaning is that I…

Imagine you are paranoid and you suspect someone is deceiving you. The reality of whether or not they are actually deceiving you does not have an impact on how much pain you feel. Alternatively, someone with a mental condition that leads them to believe they are in pain would conceivably feel the same pain as someone who is actually being physically hurt. Just my take on it.

As malloryerik said in another comment, that seems to be confusing the cause of the pain with the pain itself. The paranoiac's pain is real, even if the cause is imaginary.

Re: Bullshit-sensitivity predicts prosocial behavior

#68

Post by nichtich »

__david__ wrote: post #50
tabs_masterrace wrote: post #28

> Health and tolerance provides creativity for the future. This one is classified bullshit, although I think it makes at least somewhat sense.

Howso? I don't see how either health or tolerance is related to creativity… Also why only future creativity?

Because they imply a safer and longer life and the creativity of dead people are zero. I think it makes some sense.

Re: Bullshit-sensitivity predicts prosocial behavior

#69

Post by stult »

malloryerik wrote: post #61
duopixel wrote: post #19

A simple self-experiment if you haven't read the paper, find which of these sentences are bullshit. Answer in order without reading further ahead, and don't go back to change your answers (as to replicate experimental conditions). * 1. A river cuts through a rock, not because of its power but it's persistence. 2. The hidden meaning transforms the abstract beauty. 3. The future elucidates irrational facts for the seek…

> 11. Imagined pain does not hurt less because it is imagined. This statement confuses cause (some damage) and effect (pain) and so should be in the bullshit category, or else it's poorly written/translated. An imagined cause may lead to real pain, for example if you believe you've been betrayed but you haven't. The pain is the same as if you had actually been betrayed, and in both cases that pain isn't imagined, it'…

The study doesn't make any claims about the validity of the "actually" profound statements, because the validity or lack thereof is irrelevant to the study. Those statements simply have actual semantic content, as opposed to the meaningless bullshit statements, which don't communicate anything and therefore can't even be assessed for their validity.

Re: Bullshit-sensitivity predicts prosocial behavior

#70

Post by foldr »

stult wrote: post #69
malloryerik wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 11. Imagined pain does not hurt less because it is imagined. This statement confuses cause (some damage) and effect (pain) and so should be in the bullshit category, or else it's poorly written/translated. An imagined cause may lead to real pain, for example if you believe you've been betrayed but you haven't. The pain is the same as if you had actually been betrayed, and in both cases that pain isn't imagined, it'…

The study doesn't make any claims about the validity of the "actually" profound statements, because the validity or lack thereof is irrelevant to the study. Those statements simply have actual semantic content, as opposed to the meaningless bullshit statements, which don't communicate anything and therefore can't even be assessed for their validity.

Right, but if you ask people whether a sentence is 'profound' or 'bullshit', then it's pretty unclear which of those two categories you should put a sentence in if it makes sense but is also clearly false. Such a sentence doesn't really fall into either category. "The moon is made of cheese" has semantic content, but it's not very profound.
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