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YC China and Qi Lu

blog.ycombinator.com

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Re: YC China and Qi Lu

#181

Post by est »

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #125
tanilama wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> and you could still get access to the market you're targeting. This is not true. Taiwanese investment in China is considered 'external'. And Taiwan's talent reserve is no way to be considered as on par against mainland China. But that is not the point either, I think YC just wants an entity in China, not for the talents, but for the market. Under the risk of being downvoted, I have to say China has created some wor…

China has startups, they are definitely many high in quality, but they aren’t really world class in terms of talent used (almost completely Chinese) and markets targeted (ditto). China will have trouble getting its tech companies to compete abroad when they have closed off their own market so much. Likewise, until China embraces immigration rather than emigration, talent is unlikely to flock to China in any significa…

The only country had world-class Internet products are US companies.

Re: YC China and Qi Lu

#182

Post by est »

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #137
tomtang0514 wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not 100% true. Amazon and (previously) ebay operate in china without problem but don't get a chance facing alibaba. Microsoft also do things fine. Uber was also there. The market that's really closed off are mostly limited to companies that don't support censorship. Also speaking of world class, have you heard of DJI?

I did work for MS China for almost 10 years, and Microsoft does sell shrink wrap software in China, but they don't really do services there, they've tried and even though they are on the government's good side, it just never worked out for them. Microsoft is a good example of my claim. Not trying to move the goalpost, but DJI is more of a hardware company, it isn't really an internet one. Any company that can operate…

Azure Cloud is operating fine in China, so does Office365. Are these services?

Also AWS China is a huge deal.

Re: YC China and Qi Lu

#183

Post by est »

philip1209 wrote: post #162

What effect does switching from Baidu to YC have on Qi's social credit system rating?

Does any Chinese internet user ever tell a single story that has a exact score of the so called "social credit system"?

Have you ever wondered why?

Re: YC China and Qi Lu

#184

Post by erikb »

fsloth wrote: post #51
ulfw wrote: post #44

I find it funny how YC is focusing only on places where the majority of the world won’t or can’t easily work (US visa policy is atrocious and getting worse every year + raising xenophobia in recent times) and China isn’t an easy country to navigate if you don’t speak Mandarin, let alone succeed in as a foreigner (for a variety of reasons). Asia and Europe are big places as are Canada and Australia. Time to think broa…

1. It's not about empowering everyone on the planet, it's about creating companies which become billion dollar unicorns 2. The probability of Unicornism is directly related to the size of the market you can access. US is the biggest single market on the planet. 3. Accessibility of markets: While EU is the second largest single market [0] US companies have entered european markets just fine. On the other hand, to oper…

China is a lot bigger market than the US. EU is slightly bigger. US is third. Maybe with extended markets (e.g. Central America and Canada for US, Eastern Europe for EU, Belt and Road area for China, US is number two). You need to consider several factors, like number of people, as well.

A big problem for the US is that it is a litle off, while most other social/cultural areas are closely connected. For instance, China and Russia might be almost as close allies as the pre-Trump US and Europe. But because Russia and Europe are so close, in fact the business dependencies between both are quite high as well. So a lot of business happens in that exchange, with high values due to the political risks. Since the US lacks such interdependencies with close neighbors it can survive better in a time like WW2 but it is harder in a long peace time like we currently have.

Re: YC China and Qi Lu

#185

Post by Grue3 »

gdsdfe wrote: post #35

Hahaha people talking about ethics are silly ... This is business in a market, potentially, at least 3x bigger than the current biggest market! Are you nuts? Everybody's gonna do business in China! Everybody! In some form or shape.

[flagged]

Re: YC China and Qi Lu

#186

Post by est »

nullifidian wrote: post #132

>to ensure that the benefits of that are fairly spread throughout humanity. What about Uighur internment camps YC money will finance through taxes?

yeah what about US corporations exploiting cheap Chinese child labor as a manufacturing base.

Re: YC China and Qi Lu

#187

Post by avcdsuia »

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #96
telltruth wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Mandarin isn't strictly necessary to live in China Basic question: what do you do in China for browsing, emails and maps? I suppose Google doesn't work there and all the local services would be in Mandarin, no? When I travel I use Google search, emails, maps extensively but I have no clue what would I do in China. Also FB and Twitter also likely won't be accessible. So how do I even keep touch with folks outside Ch…

Many foreigners have VPNs, but many do not. They aren't the easiest thing to set up, and they often close shop a few weeks after you pay a yearly subscription fee. Email: I use outlook.com, but I shut my gmail account long before gmail was blocked. I'm weird. maps: Apple Maps on an iphone works well enough. Not sure if gmaps on Android works or not. Many Google services still work even if a few are blocked. Browsing:…

For crying out loud, even using github based services like 'go get' or homebrew without proxies is a real pain in the arse, stop defending your 'it's not that bad' view cos it is.

Re: YC China and Qi Lu

#188

Post by 4684499 »

friedman23 wrote: post #14
est wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Since when Code of Ethics equals to McCarthyism?

Doing business in China is unethical.

You don't have to serve the government.

If you refuse to serve Chinese people, that's another level of the story.

If you think serving people in China is somehow helping the government, you are somehow admitting the legitimacy of the government.

Is it ethical that doing business in Five Eye countries?

Is providing tools/services to the people considered unethical comparing to providing none?

What about free services that everyone including the Chinese can access via Internet? Are they unethical because they didn't block the Chinese?

Thoughts?

Re: YC China and Qi Lu

#189

Post by fsloth »

erikb wrote: post #184
fsloth wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1. It's not about empowering everyone on the planet, it's about creating companies which become billion dollar unicorns 2. The probability of Unicornism is directly related to the size of the market you can access. US is the biggest single market on the planet. 3. Accessibility of markets: While EU is the second largest single market [0] US companies have entered european markets just fine. On the other hand, to oper…

China is a lot bigger market than the US. EU is slightly bigger. US is third. Maybe with extended markets (e.g. Central America and Canada for US, Eastern Europe for EU, Belt and Road area for China, US is number two). You need to consider several factors, like number of people, as well. A big problem for the US is that it is a litle off, while most other social/cultural areas are closely connected. For instance, Chi…

"China and Russia might be almost as close allies as the pre-Trump US and Europe. "

That completely underestimates the cultural ties US and 'Europe' has and overestimates the co-operation between parties who co-operate pragmatically from time to time but really can't trust or understand each other.

" US lacks such interdependencies with close neighbors it can survive better in a time like WW2 but it is harder in a long peace time like we currently have."

That's some extremely peculiar economic calculus.

Re: YC China and Qi Lu

#190

Post by google_censors »

jumelles wrote: post #30
ardy42 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I worry about what sort of concessions tech companies have made and will make to gain access to the Chinese market. Especially since the PRC government is getting much more aggressive in forcing Western companies to kowtow to their political stances even in their operations outside of China. Mercedes-Benz was forced to apologize for posting a Dalai Lama quote on Instagram [1], and a Marriott employee was fired afte…

Agreed 100%. To me it's madness that Marriott and Benz wouldn't stand up for the right to speak one's mind.

You mean Mercedes, the company that used slave laborers from camps to build vehicles and engines for the Nazis?
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