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YC China and Qi Lu

blog.ycombinator.com

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Re: YC China and Qi Lu

#61

Post by seanmcdirmid »

bing_dai wrote: post #37

I'm wondering which city will the YC China be based in? Certainly one of Beijing/Shenzhen/Shanghai I would guess.

Beijing would make sense for political reasons, and it also has a strong software culture. Shenzhen for hardware, and maybe Tencent. Shanghai...would be the dark horse in that race, but it is the NYC of China.

I wish they would pick a western city, like Chengdu or Kunming...to become the "san francisco" of China. But there is really not much in those places to work with.

Re: YC China and Qi Lu

#62

Post by jumelles »

est wrote: post #57
jumelles wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We should never, ever make concessions when it comes to human rights.

Elon Musk needs to hear that. Stop doing business with Saudi Arabia's sovereign wealth fund!

Yes. With the astronomical level of clout that Elon Musk has, I'm willing to call him immoral, unethical, and a bad person for doing business with KSA. A vanishingly small number of people are as influential as Musk, and his actions inspire and are emulated worldwide. Saudi Arabia is currently trying to rehabilitate its image (while maintaining its vicious corporal punishments, extremist views, support of terrorism, and legalized misogyny) and shouldn't have help from anyone who claims to care about anything other than profit.

Re: YC China and Qi Lu

#63

Post by shard972 »

varsitywork wrote: post #50
shard972 wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Lord help us if the Chinese government somehow gets its hands on a superior weapons tech, or smarter AI. Why wouldn't they get their hands on that? With companies like HPE existing as now defacto chinese companies I just don't see how anyone can see this as a if rather than a when. > We're literally handing the Chinese government some of the Western world's greatest knowledge and inventions. Isn't this great though…

> Why wouldn't they get their hands on that? They wouldn't because most of the western democratic countries are now actively preventing China from stealing their technologies. US with the empowered CFIUS, with the latest defense bill. Germany just prevented 2 key companies from being taken over by China. France drafted anti-takeover measures (aimed at China) amid foreign investment boom. EU is actively seeking to put…

> They wouldn't because most of the western democratic countries are now actively preventing China from stealing their technologies.

Thats all kind of small considering the kind of information that has already been dropshiped out with no real punishments to the chinese government itself.

All these efforts are is trying to plug the holes, not realizing the holes aren't just company buyouts but mostly espionage via chinese citizens. Even if you lock them up, they still sent the data, nothing was really prevented.

> And yet Sam Altman is just going to give China free knowhow/technologies.

Yea? Because that's all government and politics. This is markets and profits.

> Are you not aware of the sesame credit enacted by the Chinese government? Facial recognition in cameras installed everywhere?

Yea alot of people actually like it, being able to get benefits for being an upstanding system. I've heard it described as a system of karma.

Besides, we have the same things anyway, credit scores and CCTV, we just have a different cultural view of it.

> Millions of muslims in reeducation camps in Xinjiang?

And we don't put muslims in jail at higher rates than the native populations? See this just all seems like reflecting the fact that all countries have these issues.

> If anything, the Chinese government can take over a private startup quickly, and use the tech against Silicon Valley companies.

Maybe, but that's the business risk you take. If they think that's the best way to run their country, what right do we have to tell them they are wrong? Especially when we aren't exactly innocent.

Re: YC China and Qi Lu

#64

Post by jumelles »

fsloth wrote: post #54
jumelles wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed 100%. To me it's madness that Marriott and Benz wouldn't stand up for the right to speak one's mind.

I'm pretty sure Marriott and Benz stand up firsthand to their owners and in their list of priorities access to chinese markets is more important than human rights. Given our worship of capital I'm amazed global emancipation of slavery ever happened. But I suppose that was only because new financial markets and industrialization created lots of better opportunities for capital investment than slave labour force - henc…

> I'm pretty sure Marriott and Benz stand up firsthand to their owners and in their list of priorities access to chinese markets is more important than human rights.

That is indeed the problem.

Re: YC China and Qi Lu

#65

Post by vsr_pg »

telltruth wrote: post #24

Sam, this exec BS doesn't look good on you. If Qi Lu is the "one of the most impressive technologiest" you have known then I would say you can be impressed pretty easily. Qi Lu is the guy who couldn't do a squat with Yahoo so he jumped ship to Microsoft. His main achievement there was to rename their product to "Bing". Finally not getting anywhere for almost a decade, he finally got pushed out and so he jumped on the…

Not sure what your sources are. It would help to cite sources, or at least come out of anonymity before blasting someone like this. That way we can at least evaluate your opinion based on your relevant background.

Re: YC China and Qi Lu

#66

Post by echevil »

echan00 wrote: post #17

Key question: will Chinese startups be required to register as US companies :)

Nope. There’re tons of Chinese startups already with or without YC. Would US startups be required to register as Chinese companies if they receive Chinese VC money?

Re: YC China and Qi Lu

#67

Post by shard972 »

jumelles wrote: post #32
toomuchtodo wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Than you be pragmatic and make concessions.

We should never, ever make concessions when it comes to human rights.

That's just your opinion. Other companies can have other opinions too, as long as the law doesn't force us either way.

Re: YC China and Qi Lu

#68

Post by IntelMiner »

shard972 wrote: post #52
jumelles wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Caring about human rights is silly?

If you want to make it in China then yea, you probably shouldn't be too hung up on human rights. It's not some universal concept that has applied throughout the world for our existence so it's quite rude to pretend like China has to bow to these systems of human rights we developed without china's input.

The Chinese government is not the Chinese people

I don't think the Chinese people approve of many of the things their government does. Though censorship makes dissent harder to "prove"

Re: YC China and Qi Lu

#69

Post by jumelles »

shard972 wrote: post #63
varsitywork wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why wouldn't they get their hands on that? They wouldn't because most of the western democratic countries are now actively preventing China from stealing their technologies. US with the empowered CFIUS, with the latest defense bill. Germany just prevented 2 key companies from being taken over by China. France drafted anti-takeover measures (aimed at China) amid foreign investment boom. EU is actively seeking to put…

> They wouldn't because most of the western democratic countries are now actively preventing China from stealing their technologies. Thats all kind of small considering the kind of information that has already been dropshiped out with no real punishments to the chinese government itself. All these efforts are is trying to plug the holes, not realizing the holes aren't just company buyouts but mostly espionage via chi…

This sort of whataboutism isn't helpful. We have the right to call out human rights abuses; further, I think we have an obligation to use that right lest we lose it. Are you aware that the average citizen in China simply cannot tell their government that it's wrong? It doesn't matter what abuses the US or other Western nations have or haven't done - the PRC is still in the wrong.

Re: YC China and Qi Lu

#70

Post by thawab »

jumelles wrote: post #15

YC's got a very, very fine line to tread if they're serious about China - with its limits on human rights and authoritarian tendencies, the Chinese government is absolutely not to be trusted. I worry about what sort of concessions tech companies have made and will make to gain access to the Chinese market.

Every one wants to be part of the next Chinese startups, an incubator has less risk than other big corporations. Qi Lu knows technology and knows how to navigate his way with the Chinese government. Hopefully they can be part of the startup ecosystem in China.
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