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When Security Compromises Security – The Caesars/Defcon debacle

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Re: When Security Compromises Security – The Caesars/Defcon debacle

#61

Post by kkop »

dewey wrote: post #42
awiesenhofer wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The good news: you can watch practically all sessions on youtube: https://youtube.com/user/mediacccde/playlists

While this is nice if you are just interested in some of the talks it's not really a substitute for being there, meeting people and taking in the atmosphere (for me at least. There's a lot of things you don't see in the streams, like the venue, the tents and all the small cool things in the assembly area.

I have been once a few years ago. Some of it is certainly enjoyable, like meeting people you know from the Internet or wouldn't have meet otherwise. And overall the organizers are doing a good job. But it feels like a lot people go year after year no matter what, in a bad way. Thousands of similar people talking about the same things year after year. Add to that the cost and logistics of it all, and don't feel much of a need of going again.

So I might be worth it for people who haven't experienced that sort of thing. But otherwise I would recommend watching online with some friends and travelling someplace else for new experiences.

Re: When Security Compromises Security – The Caesars/Defcon debacle

#62

Post by bjt2n3904 »

kkop wrote: post #28
jimnotgym wrote: post #10

I am not part of the DEFCON community, but every year I hear about warrantless searches, equipment seized art the border and hacker arrests. I wonder why anyone, not least security researchers, would take the risk of going there. Just so as you guys know, we have conference facilities in Europe...

Much of the "we stand up to authority" hubbub of US security researchers and developers is mostly an act. The sentiment is there to comfort the participants and validate their existence, just like in many other industries. While I hope I am wrong I wouldn't expect people not to fold when it matters. Somewhat understandably so since the current alternative is arguably, or at least ultimately, exile. Just look at this…

> Much of the "we stand up to authority" hubbub of US security researchers and developers is mostly an act.

Source, go through the body scanners at the TSA. Worn down, can't be bothered to "echo FUUUUUUUU > /dev/null" any more.

Re: When Security Compromises Security – The Caesars/Defcon debacle

#63

Post by blattimwind »

fbender wrote: post #32
Cthulhu_ wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Warrantless search only applies if it was the police going in there; if it's hotel security, and if the terms and conditions of said hotel indicate hotel security can enter your room at any given time, then you'll have nothing.

Unless you‘re in Europe (or at least Germany) where Hotel staff is only allowed to enter on your invitation, no matter what the ToS say.

> Unless you‘re in Europe (or at least Germany) where Hotel staff is only allowed to enter on your invitation, no matter what the ToS say.

Sad how govermenmt regulation swoops down on valid business interests.

Re: When Security Compromises Security – The Caesars/Defcon debacle

#64

Post by [deleted] »

jimnotgym wrote: post #10

I am not part of the DEFCON community, but every year I hear about warrantless searches, equipment seized art the border and hacker arrests. I wonder why anyone, not least security researchers, would take the risk of going there. Just so as you guys know, we have conference facilities in Europe...

[deleted]

Re: When Security Compromises Security – The Caesars/Defcon debacle

#65

Post by Someone1234 »

strictnein wrote: post #54
gammateam wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is the room service really that expensive? I do remember paying extra taxes on taxes at the Encore

$75 for french onion soup, a caesar salad, and two beers $55 for a bad 18" NY style pepperoni pizza There's an 18% gratuity and a $10 delivery fee for every order.

That's astonishingly expensive. I bet you could get a local pizza place to deliver an 18" Pepperoni for half that, let alone the $10 fee.

Re: When Security Compromises Security – The Caesars/Defcon debacle

#66

Post by toomuchtodo »

jagermo wrote: post #34
ForHackernews wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

CCC is better than Defcon. It's actual hackers, not the Infosec Industry.

Sadly, it's around Christmas an I have a definitive veto from wife and kids.

Christmas in Germany!

Re: When Security Compromises Security – The Caesars/Defcon debacle

#67

Post by 0xdeadbeefbabe »

ForHackernews wrote: post #27
baby wrote: post #22

On the other hand Black Hat Asia is freaking awesome and pretty much the best BH I've been to and I keep hearing about CCC being way better thsn Defcon. There are options outside the US! Also if you're into crypto you should go to the summerschool in Croatia or the workshops at Eurocrypt!

CCC is better than Defcon. It's actual hackers, not the Infosec Industry.

Defcon used to be better than defcon. It's just what happens to communities sometimes, especially the ones with too much freedom and money.

Re: When Security Compromises Security – The Caesars/Defcon debacle

#68

Post by blueprint »

snarfy wrote: post #59
lawnchair_larry wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, defcon has no age requirement.

Yep you're correct.

Yes, there were a number of intelligent looking young children there. This however is only in furtherence of the argument that we must set good examples.

Re: When Security Compromises Security – The Caesars/Defcon debacle

#69

Post by the_duke »

blattimwind wrote: post #63
fbender wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unless you‘re in Europe (or at least Germany) where Hotel staff is only allowed to enter on your invitation, no matter what the ToS say.

> Unless you‘re in Europe (or at least Germany) where Hotel staff is only allowed to enter on your invitation, no matter what the ToS say. Sad how govermenmt regulation swoops down on valid business interests.

Sad how some governments choose to invalidate a citizens privacy rights for "valid" business interests.

A hotel can call the police any time if they suspect an issue with a guest.

Re: When Security Compromises Security – The Caesars/Defcon debacle

#70

Post by halbritt »

kkop wrote: post #28
jimnotgym wrote: post #10

I am not part of the DEFCON community, but every year I hear about warrantless searches, equipment seized art the border and hacker arrests. I wonder why anyone, not least security researchers, would take the risk of going there. Just so as you guys know, we have conference facilities in Europe...

Much of the "we stand up to authority" hubbub of US security researchers and developers is mostly an act. The sentiment is there to comfort the participants and validate their existence, just like in many other industries. While I hope I am wrong I wouldn't expect people not to fold when it matters. Somewhat understandably so since the current alternative is arguably, or at least ultimately, exile. Just look at this…

The fourth amendment absolutely applies to hotel rooms.

https://www.gsblaw.com/duff-on-hospitality-law/guest-room-pr...

https://scholarship.shu.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1048...

From my very basic understanding of what transpired, the hotel security were trespassing by entering a rented room. I'm not altogether familiar with state law in Nevada, but that could certainly be argued in California.

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