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Google will lose $50M or more in 2018 from Fortnite bypassing the Play Store

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Re: Google will lose $50M or more in 2018 from Fortnite bypassing the Play Store

#81

Post by kodablah »

redbeard0x0a wrote: post #73
lucisferre wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is this not what happens with the bundling of Mail, Calendar and Music in iOS and the fact that many default actions and integrations for these apps in iOS are not available to alternatives?

No, Google got in trouble for mandating other companies/products to include Google products (gmail, chrome, etc) in their products (Samsung Galaxy 9, LG whatever phone, etc). Apple doesn't mandate any other company to change something with their product (Apple installs mail, calendar, music on their own iPhone, iPad, etc). They aren't using their market position to coerce another company to do something in Apple's fa…

> No, Google got in trouble for mandating other companies/products to include Google products (gmail, chrome, etc) in their products (Samsung Galaxy 9, LG whatever phone, etc).

If you only look for one thing they got in trouble for. Other things include prioritizing their shopping results on their search engine. There are cases and rulings that don't have anything to do with "coerce another company" wrt monopoly laws. You can be in trouble for only putting your own products on your own products too, no other company has to be involved...just have to be large enough (by volume).

Re: Google will lose $50M or more in 2018 from Fortnite bypassing the Play Store

#82

Post by ocdtrekkie »

Skunkleton wrote: post #5

I can't imagine that 100% of the people interested in fortnite for android are willing to sideload the apk. I would be surprised if this wasn't having a net-negative impact on the total number of android users. I wonder if this is just to avoid paying a percentage on in-app purchases? What else could it be?

If they lose less than 30% of their installs, but are making 30% more on each IAP, they're rolling profit. Bear in mind, most users won't even buy stuff, so the question is... will they lose a lot of paying customers, and my guess for that is no.

Also, Tim Sweeney is an outspoken critic of the app store model, so it's unsurprising to see Epic go this way where they can.

Re: Google will lose $50M or more in 2018 from Fortnite bypassing the Play Store

#84

Post by asdkhadsj »

Drakim wrote: post #27
asdkhadsj wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also, what solution would there be? Allow other companies to bypass Google's revenue system in this area? How much will they lose from other companies who want to be treated equal to Fortnite. edit : This is a question folks, I'm not sure why you're down voting a question.. ya'll are touchy as hell lol. To put it differently, since I think my first attempt just confused you all in mass: If Google were to lower it's t…

I don't understand the framing of this conversation. Does other companies owe Google money by merely existing?

I think you misunderstand me.

In other words, the claim is that Google is "losing" money by their choices which cause Fortnite to choose to not use them. But it's those same choices which make Google money.

So if Google were to, for example, take less of a cut - they might get Fortnite onto their system. But how much would they loose from all the other companies currently using Google at the current rate?

Re: Google will lose $50M or more in 2018 from Fortnite bypassing the Play Store

#85

Post by adamtulinius »

miguelrochefort wrote: post #65
mkhalil wrote: post #43

I wonder if this becomes a norm in the Android freemium gaming community, will they start advertising more Android ads to iPhone users. Maybe even start offering free "trade-up" program if they spend enough. If a user spends $1000, and 30% goes to Apple, that's $300 that could of bought the user a dedicated gaming device that will allow them to avoid that 30% tax. I love Apple, but 30% for in-app purchases is somethi…

> If a user spends $1000, and 30% goes to Apple, that's $300 that could of bought the user a dedicated gaming device that will allow them to avoid that 30% tax. How many iOS users willing to invest $300 on a low-end Android device to play Fortnite in order to start saving 30% after spending over $700 in in-app purchases do you think exist in the world?

The $1000 can be spend on multiple games.

Re: Google will lose $50M or more in 2018 from Fortnite bypassing the Play Store

#86

Post by scarface74 »

gkoberger wrote: post #11

The framing of this article feels weird to me. Google offers a service (distribution), and it just so happens Fortnite doesn't need it. It also completely ignores how much Fortnite will lose from people who don't install it because they can't figure out how. A better way would be "Fortnite is big enough to bypass Google and still make $180MM", rather than acting like this is Google's fault. I mean, the fact that phon…

How is this any more or less insane than every console maker getting a cut of every game distributed either physically or digitally? For you to sell a physical game disk, you still have to have a cryptographic signature issued by the console maker.

Re: Google will lose $50M or more in 2018 from Fortnite bypassing the Play Store

#87

Post by jaxondu »

lern_too_spel wrote: post #80
jaxondu wrote: post #34

Just curious why in China there are several app stores for Android (Tencent, 360, Baidu etc), while the rest of the world uses mainly Google Play Store?

The Google Play Store is outside the great firewall and therefore probably unusable in China. Phone makers aren't going to ship phones with unusable app stores, so they need to use alternatives. It's the same reason UC Browser and QQ Browser are so popular in China.

I'm curious why there aren't more app store outside China, as evidently from China example, the app store business is sustainable, and Android outside China has a bigger market.

Re: Google will lose $50M or more in 2018 from Fortnite bypassing the Play Store

#88

Post by muro »

redbeard0x0a wrote: post #73
lucisferre wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is this not what happens with the bundling of Mail, Calendar and Music in iOS and the fact that many default actions and integrations for these apps in iOS are not available to alternatives?

No, Google got in trouble for mandating other companies/products to include Google products (gmail, chrome, etc) in their products (Samsung Galaxy 9, LG whatever phone, etc). Apple doesn't mandate any other company to change something with their product (Apple installs mail, calendar, music on their own iPhone, iPad, etc). They aren't using their market position to coerce another company to do something in Apple's fa…

Only Chrome, Play Store and Search app.

Re: Google will lose $50M or more in 2018 from Fortnite bypassing the Play Store

#89

Post by bena »

TremendousJudge wrote: post #45
Drakim wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand the framing of this conversation. Does other companies owe Google money by merely existing?

No, it's the same writing that frames piracy as "costing" money to the developers. If something costs you some money there's the implication that you had the money, and then you didn't have it after that something happening. As much as they'd like to believe it, projected earnings aren't money you actually have

I'd say that the piracy does cost developers something. Not every pirated copy is a lost sale, but there are some number of people who are capable of buying software that instead choose to pirate it for any number of reasons and would buy it if piracy was not an option.

I wouldn't say it's a high percentage, but it's not insignificant.

I'd count that as a lost sale.

But I do agree that this is a different situation. This is just a high profile application that has decided to forgo something completely optional.

Re: Google will lose $50M or more in 2018 from Fortnite bypassing the Play Store

#90

Post by asdkhadsj »

jdietrich wrote: post #77
asdkhadsj wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also, what solution would there be? Allow other companies to bypass Google's revenue system in this area? How much will they lose from other companies who want to be treated equal to Fortnite. edit : This is a question folks, I'm not sure why you're down voting a question.. ya'll are touchy as hell lol. To put it differently, since I think my first attempt just confused you all in mass: If Google were to lower it's t…

Anyone can provide an APK download from their website and bypass the Play Store. Unlike iOS, Android is not a walled garden. For most app developers, the ease of discovery, installation and payment provided by the Play Store is worth the 30% fee. Epic Games clearly think that Fortnite is in such high demand that it isn't worth paying the Play Store tax; Fortnite players will make the effort to find the app, install i…

I think you misunderstand me. As I said in another post:

> In other words, the claim is that Google is "losing" money by their choices which cause Fortnite to choose to not use them. But it's those same choices which make Google money.

> So if Google were to, for example, take less of a cut - they might get Fortnite onto their system. But how much would they loose from all the other companies currently using Google at the current rate?

I'm not sure what your point is, so I can only assume you're arguing what you thought I meant. My point was simple a question, hypothetically if Google were to chance it's pricing scheme to something that would fit Epic, would it be a net gain or a loss to them?

I'm unsure how anything in your post applies to my question.

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