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YouTube Bans Alex Jones, Following Facebook's and Apple's Lead

arstechnica.com

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Re: YouTube Bans Alex Jones, Following Facebook's and Apple's Lead

#181

Post by malvosenior »

tptacek wrote: post #179
malvosenior wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The NYT just hired a full blown racist to their editorial board so I think it's a very apt comparison.

Eschew flamebait. Don't introduce flamewar topics unless you have something genuinely new to say. Avoid unrelated controversies and generic tangents.

This is directly related to the article. The NYT is literally doing a 180 of what they were saying two days ago.

Also, you're not a mod so I don't see why you're trolling through a day old post to finger wag at people who don't agree with your politics.

Re: YouTube Bans Alex Jones, Following Facebook's and Apple's Lead

#182

Post by tptacek »

malvosenior wrote: post #181
tptacek wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eschew flamebait. Don't introduce flamewar topics unless you have something genuinely new to say. Avoid unrelated controversies and generic tangents.

This is directly related to the article. The NYT is literally doing a 180 of what they were saying two days ago. Also, you're not a mod so I don't see why you're trolling through a day old post to finger wag at people who don't agree with your politics.

Everybody feels their tangents are crucially related to the stories they add them to. On tech threads where we're all just riffing on stuff, that's fine. But all you had to say was that Sarah Jeong is "a full blown racist". Your comment is a textbook example of why we have the guideline.

I'm sorry I don't keep up-to-the-minute with your comments.

Re: YouTube Bans Alex Jones, Following Facebook's and Apple's Lead

#183

Post by malvosenior »

tptacek wrote: post #182
malvosenior wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is directly related to the article. The NYT is literally doing a 180 of what they were saying two days ago. Also, you're not a mod so I don't see why you're trolling through a day old post to finger wag at people who don't agree with your politics.

Everybody feels their tangents are crucially related to the stories they add them to. On tech threads where we're all just riffing on stuff, that's fine. But all you had to say was that Sarah Jeong is "a full blown racist". Your comment is a textbook example of why we have the guideline. I'm sorry I don't keep up-to-the-minute with your comments.

Do you realize we're in a thread (that I didn't start) discussing the NYT's credibility on reporting this issue? How about you reply to the content of my comment instead of trying to take it out of context and spamming the thread?

Re: YouTube Bans Alex Jones, Following Facebook's and Apple's Lead

#184

Post by whatyoucantsay »

rurounijones wrote: post #142
whatyoucantsay wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You cherry picked and forgot the first line which puts the rest in context. How uncharitable of you to write that. I didn't "forget" it. It wasn't relevant to my point. The first line was specific to this situation, but the final two I quoted represent a very universal and timeless position. In fact, ancient Athens suffered greatly when "silence the voices of the enemies of democracy" became the dominant position i…

You're "point" was a snarky off the cuff one-liner. Universal and Timeless position is a stretch. It is not black and white, it is grey and the first line in OPs comment put context to that grey. While it would be lovely to have a democracy with an educated rational electorate resilent to hateful demagogues and other threats to the stability of that democracy, we are not there. In that situation you can let it fester…

"Ideas I disagree with are wrong and should be silenced!" is about as timeless and universal a position as any in human history.

It's not a good one, though.

Re: YouTube Bans Alex Jones, Following Facebook's and Apple's Lead

#185

Post by Rubinsalamander »

thomk wrote: post #157
iovrthoughtthis wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Theres lots to unpack here. > He is an opportunity. By becoming a lightening rod and focal point for a large fraction of a country's misguided thinking, he has made that misguided thinking more fragile. Easier to dislodge. Because now you just need to find a combination of words that helps his followers see him for what he actually is. His followers see themselves in him. Attack him and they will feel attacked. Attac…

"The only way to change peoples minds is to realize that you can’t. You can only make it safe for them to change their own minds." I'm curious where you heard that, it's an interesting perspective I have not considered before.

Two well informed people can come to different conclusions on the same topic despite both having access to the same information. Its their underlying believes that makes both feel their opinion is right and logical.

If you want to change opinions you have to change the underlying believes that form them. And you have to do it in a way that they feel they figured it out on their own.

If you do it in a "push down the throat" way it will just make it worse.

In that light i dont think the ban was a good idea...

Re: YouTube Bans Alex Jones, Following Facebook's and Apple's Lead

#186

Post by ffgdgggg »

mcphage wrote: post #171
acct1771 wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How has it gone wrong? What consequences have there been?

Death threats to people whose children were murdered, so bad that they had to leave their home? Men with guns showing up at pizza parlors where people were trying to eat dinner? Does any of this ring a bell?

Reminds me of when GOP congressmen were attacked by a sniper, spokespersons harrassed with their families at a restaurant, etc.

egged on by some congresslady in California and MSNBC.

So ya. Pretty simmetrical.

Re: YouTube Bans Alex Jones, Following Facebook's and Apple's Lead

#187

Post by ffgdgggg »

torpfactory wrote: post #62
j-c-hewitt wrote: post #40

I think the reason why Alex Jones became popular is because the mainstream news websites like CNN and even sections of the NYT became more Jones-like in their reporting. When people are just choosing between different sensationalist conspiracy theory websites it becomes much more challenging for ordinary people to pick a quality outlet. The thing is that most of the web and the printed word is spam that will actively…

Oh please. What a load of hogwash. NYT and CNN aren’t perfect but making some kind of comparison to the rantings of a lunatic like Jones is absurd. Get a grip.

CNN??? The ones who invented ADHD news: “not necessarily correct, we never check our sources, but you’ll forget by tomorrow”

NYT is a tool of political control. More sophisticated than Jones, but so what? Their readers want to feign being better than their cab driver.

NYT will publish mostly truths to Jones’ mostly trash but in a way that is as manipulative.

NYT’s Friedman will write a peon on MBS while the man commits a genicide in Yemen

Read Chomsky, Seymour Hersh, or Robert Perry. There is no journalism in America.

Re: YouTube Bans Alex Jones, Following Facebook's and Apple's Lead

#188

Post by ffgdgggg »

tptacek wrote: post #180
_Tev wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well for you it might be clear it is much better than Jones, but from the distance the "us vs them" narrative and the obsession with whatever is the latest "scandal" (Clinton's emails, Weinstein, Trump & Russia) makes it seem like pure tabloid. So you can actually make good argument about NYT being similar to Jones (better crap is still crap).

It's quite clear if you understand the distinction between journalism and infotainment. Journalism outlets spend millions of dollars to staff professional reporters and fact checkers; when they report a story, they've often got a whole team of trained professionals on multiple locations collecting details and interviewing primary sources. When the outlet we're talking about is the NYT or WSJ, those teams are in dozen…

Editorial staffs have been decimated for decades.

There is far less fact checking than before, far fewer corespondents and almost all military reporting is through access-journalism: “our give us pretty footage, we’ll write nice things”

At which point I prefer Jones: so trashy that I know it’s BS

Re: YouTube Bans Alex Jones, Following Facebook's and Apple's Lead

#189

Post by ffgdgggg »

jimejim wrote: post #166
malvosenior wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The NYT just hired a full blown racist to their editorial board so I think it's a very apt comparison.

No, they didn't. The people that think Sarah Jeong is a racist are the kind of people that take Alex Jones seriously.

If Sarah Jeong is not a racist, which I will concede, than she is an immature idiot mouthing off in public.

Which tarnishes the reputation of her employer.

Alex Jones is also an immature idiot. But he owns his show.

Re: YouTube Bans Alex Jones, Following Facebook's and Apple's Lead

#190

Post by ffgdgggg »

tchaffee wrote: post #132
wmil wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The major risk is the FEC. This push is coming from a desire to prevent Jones from being active in the 2018 midterms. If a Republican files a complaint with the FEC and there are employee messages talking about how they have to ban Jones to stop Trump, then the tech companies could have a situation on their hands.

What situation? What law would a company or individual be breaking by working to stop getting Trump elected again?

Electoral laws.
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