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Taking Tesla Private

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Re: Taking Tesla Private

#241

Post by spadros »

derriz wrote: post #211

Not directly related to the thread, but I'm surpised by the extreme anti-short seller sentiment? Why is it important that they suffer? Short-selling is what makes almost zero expense mutual/index funds available to mom n' pop investors. Fidelity are about to offer ZERO TER funds on the basis that short-sellers pay heavily to borrow stock from them. It seems analogous to expressing hatred for umbrella sellers because…

I think people here aren't saying they hate shorting in general, but that Musk hates people shorting his company. So it's Musk enjoying twisting the knife in the shorters, not these guys on Hacker News.

Re: Taking Tesla Private

#242

Post by majewsky »

paganel wrote: post #143
gameswithgo wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The free market of automobile manufacturing in which the USA has propped up both GM and Ford, and in the past Chrysler? The one in which the Japanese government is carefully intertwined with their automotive industry? The government is a customer of space x but they still compete against other companies for that business.

The French government is also a big shareholder of Renault and Volkswagen is partially owned by the regional government where they’re domiciled, if I’m not mistaken, plus the German government itself always putting the interests of the German big 3 (MB, BMW, VW) ahead of almost everything else, even their citizens’ health (see the tax incentives given to diesel vehicles for the last couple of decades).

Correct. Also a large part of the reason why we still don't have universal speed limits on Autobahnen.

Re: Taking Tesla Private

#243

Post by spadros »

spadros wrote: post #241
derriz wrote: post #211

Not directly related to the thread, but I'm surpised by the extreme anti-short seller sentiment? Why is it important that they suffer? Short-selling is what makes almost zero expense mutual/index funds available to mom n' pop investors. Fidelity are about to offer ZERO TER funds on the basis that short-sellers pay heavily to borrow stock from them. It seems analogous to expressing hatred for umbrella sellers because…

I think people here aren't saying they hate shorting in general, but that Musk hates people shorting his company. So it's Musk enjoying twisting the knife in the shorters, not these guys on Hacker News.

Also if you're a long term investor you probably hate shorters and traders.

Re: Taking Tesla Private

#244

Post by orcdork »

gknoy wrote: post #152
orcdork wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He's smart, and also a monumental dickwad. I'd expect people that dislike him to do so for the latter, not the former. (i'm on that boat too)

> also a monumental dickwad I admit that I've never scrutinized his actions very closely, but I've never gotten that impression. Would you be willing to elaborate on why you feel that way?

The couple of things that spring to mind is accusing one of the cave rescuers recently of being a pedophile for no particular reason and without any proof, and a fairly well shared article by his first wife on his behavior.

From what I've seen/read of him as a person, he sounds like someone i would actively avoid in a social setting.

Re: Taking Tesla Private

#245

Post by eanzenberg »

dunpeal wrote: post #156
sulam wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He has to find financing. There’s not that many entities that can finance a deal of this magnitude.

Of course, but everything he says implies he has the funding. Announcing this before funding is in place (the most crucial piece of this puzzle) would be incredibly irresponsible.

And yet here we are, from Elon "You're a Pedo" Musk.

Re: Taking Tesla Private

#246

Post by gamblor956 »

Johnny555 wrote: post #196
gamblor956 wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Boeing is publicly traded under the ticker BA...

I meant the SpaceX stock doesn't swing wildly every time news like this comes out: https://www.investopedia.com/news/spacex-will-fly-astronauts... Or this: https://arstechnica.com/science/2018/07/nasa-commercial-crew... (I clarified my original comment)

SpaceX is privately held, unlike Tesla.

Re: Taking Tesla Private

#247

Post by gamblor956 »

ilove_banh_mi wrote: post #204
gamblor956 wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tesla has also received a substantial amount of government support, including state and federal EV rebates for buyers of its cars (roughly $300 million), an extremely large handout from the state of Nevada ($1.3 billion), a large handout from New York ($1 billion), handouts from US Government ($500 million), carbon credits ($520 billion as of 2015). Collectively, Tesla's government support actually exceeds the govern…

My understanding is that in 2009 Ford rejected the bailout the US automakers were offered (taking instead a loan which they are still repaying, through 2022). GM was effectively nationalized (at a reported cost of $11b) and the creditors lost their shirts.

Ford received a different bailout.

Also, I mixed up GM and Chrysler on which of them repaid the loan.

Re: Taking Tesla Private

#248

Post by gamblor956 »

breakpointalpha wrote: post #197
gamblor956 wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tesla has also received a substantial amount of government support, including state and federal EV rebates for buyers of its cars (roughly $300 million), an extremely large handout from the state of Nevada ($1.3 billion), a large handout from New York ($1 billion), handouts from US Government ($500 million), carbon credits ($520 billion as of 2015). Collectively, Tesla's government support actually exceeds the govern…

False. The US government lost over $11 billion on the GM bailout. https://www.thebalance.com/auto-industry-bailout-gm-ford-chr... https://www.reuters.com/article/us-autos-gm-treasury-idUSBRE...

Yeah I mixed up GM and Chrysler on which of them repaid their bailout.

Re: Taking Tesla Private

#249

Post by whataboutism »

peeters wrote: post #93
take4 wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> CNBC reports that none of the Wall Street banks it contacted were aware of any transaction or had committed to funding a leveraged buyout of Tesla.

So there's the real story. Who is this financer (or group) with ~40 billion in capital that is willing to bet long on Tesla? That's really interesting to me, if Musk is being truthful here.

1. Apple 2. Saudi's 3. China

Re: Taking Tesla Private

#250

Post by whataboutism »

mikec3010 wrote: post #229
peeters wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a newbie when it comes to calls and puts, couldn't they just fill their shorts now (no pun intended, I seriously don't know the terminology) if they're worried about it? Tesla closed at $370.

What happens when $14bn in short interest tries to buy simultaneously?

It sounds like everyone will be buying TSLA tomorrow. Even the little guy who wants to earn the difference between $379 and $420.
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