The world is losing the war against climate change • Hacker News Board

Re: The world is losing the war against climate change

#71

Post by anoplus » Mon, Aug 06, 2018, 3:52 PM UTC

Reason077 wrote: post #29

Is there even a "war" against climate change? If there is, it's barely gotten started. For the most part, politicians are at best apathetic and at worst, actively hostile to the idea of "fighting" such a war.

From the activism I follow in my country in last decade, I learned that politicians are apathetic, and a good activism is needed to make them move. That's how lazy governments work. So I think until we fix governments performance we need to engage in efficient activism. What is efficient activism? This question interests me.

Re: The world is losing the war against climate change

#72

Post by logikblok » Mon, Aug 06, 2018, 3:52 PM UTC

radicalbyte wrote: post #50

WhompingWindows wrote: post #12

If you look at global power sector emissions from 1998 to 2018, you'll see that while we have dramatically improved upon the energy intensity (energy/capita) and even are making improvements on carbon intensity (carbon/capita), but the sad reality is this: we are still using around 35% coal power in 2018, the same as we did in 1998. And the power sector is the easiest sector to decarbonize, by the way. If you look at…

I've been looking into carbon capture recently because it's going to be vital to slowing down the warming (and buying us another 50 years for the transition). What surprised me is that I can cover double my two-car-owning European family's carbon footprint via planting trees in the UK at an annual cost of around $400. It'll cost half that to do the same in a developing country. We need a global carbon tax and we need…

Hi are you using any specific UK service to plant trees please?

Re: The world is losing the war against climate change

#73

Post by tomp » Mon, Aug 06, 2018, 3:53 PM UTC

CamTin wrote: post #35

the_cat_kittles wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i dont understand. you completely omit laws in your suggested solution. we need to pass laws that prevent businesses from fucking everything up worse than they already have. you can innovate all you want, but i think you should also not elect people who are fucking STUPID about climate change.

Laws are a reasonable (thought still incredibly difficult) solution in the parts of the planet that have the rule of law. Large parts don't, and we need different solutions in those places because this is a global problem. As an example, see this report about cheating on an international agreement about CFCs ( https://www.nrdc.org/experts/david-doniger/chilling-news-spo... which) were supposed to have been phased out…

If Trump was waging a smarter trade war, and EU helped, we could be taxing China and the rest of the "lawless" countries more effectively - e.g. tax all goods (local and imported) based on their carbon footprint - and thus effect global change.

Re: The world is losing the war against climate change

#74

Post by desireco42 » Mon, Aug 06, 2018, 3:53 PM UTC

Maybe instead of going to war, we should come to peace with our environment. I think mindset is important in looking into this issue.

Re: The world is losing the war against climate change

#75

Post by wild_preference » Mon, Aug 06, 2018, 3:53 PM UTC

sykhic wrote: post #47

btrettel wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder if future generations will think people were even serious about solving the problem. In this respect the war was lost long ago. The vast majority of people who believe climate change will have large negative consequences make no major changes to their lifestyles. As someone who rides bike for transportation largely to save money and stay in shape (I think climate change is a lost cause), the environmental cr…

The uncomfortable reality is that 7 billion people can’t all live like Americans (or Europeans). Extracting the resources necessary for everyone to live like Americans would be very bad for the environment. The effective action is to greatly reduce the number of births worldwide. It seems to me all other options are not effective.

I reckon the first step is to price negative externalities into the things we buy for once. The first reason people and businesses consume so much is because they can afford it.

Re: The world is losing the war against climate change

#76

Post by sykhic » Mon, Aug 06, 2018, 3:53 PM UTC

mrob wrote: post #56

sykhic wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The uncomfortable reality is that 7 billion people can’t all live like Americans (or Europeans). Extracting the resources necessary for everyone to live like Americans would be very bad for the environment. The effective action is to greatly reduce the number of births worldwide. It seems to me all other options are not effective.

They very likely can, but it would require a massive program of nuclear power plant building. This is unacceptable to environmentalists, who prefer to pretend that people will voluntarily reduce their quality of life.

It’s not just energy production and consumption that is the problem. Resource extraction, pollution, toxification of the environment are all contributing to the creation of a planet that sucks to live in.

Re: The world is losing the war against climate change

#77

Post by safgasCVS » Mon, Aug 06, 2018, 3:54 PM UTC

The article fees cheaply alarmist to me. Its incredibly difficult to make good predictions even 2-3 years into the future let alone whats going to happen globally decades from now. We have only started to see the effects of global warming but the really bad stuff has yet to happen - and when it does the reaction wont be linear as whats being projected here.

Re: The world is losing the war against climate change

#78

Post by newswriter99 » Mon, Aug 06, 2018, 3:54 PM UTC

carry_bit wrote: post #41

WhompingWindows wrote: post #12

If you look at global power sector emissions from 1998 to 2018, you'll see that while we have dramatically improved upon the energy intensity (energy/capita) and even are making improvements on carbon intensity (carbon/capita), but the sad reality is this: we are still using around 35% coal power in 2018, the same as we did in 1998. And the power sector is the easiest sector to decarbonize, by the way. If you look at…

Is chemical/plastic production really a source of emissions? After all, oil is used in the production of plastic because plastic has a bunch of carbon in it.

In the US plastic is produced via cracking natural gas into ethane. In Europe and China they still use crude oil and crack it into naptha, but that's starting to decrease as they turn to cheaper natgas.

Re: The world is losing the war against climate change

#79

Post by aurailious » Mon, Aug 06, 2018, 3:55 PM UTC

317070 wrote: post #2

Legitimate question: will there be a point where we speak about this war in the past tense, as in `The world lost the war against climate change'? How do we determine that turning point?

We have almost certainly already lost. The challenge now is to adapt to the change. Paris was not about bringing global temp change to 0C, just limiting it to 2C.

Fortunately planet Earth won't be bothered by us too much. The cycles of ice ages we are in will "correct" most anything we do. The loss of biodiversity will probably be our only legacy.

Re: The world is losing the war against climate change

#80

Post by SamUK96 » Mon, Aug 06, 2018, 3:55 PM UTC

radicalbyte wrote: post #50

WhompingWindows wrote: post #12

If you look at global power sector emissions from 1998 to 2018, you'll see that while we have dramatically improved upon the energy intensity (energy/capita) and even are making improvements on carbon intensity (carbon/capita), but the sad reality is this: we are still using around 35% coal power in 2018, the same as we did in 1998. And the power sector is the easiest sector to decarbonize, by the way. If you look at…

I've been looking into carbon capture recently because it's going to be vital to slowing down the warming (and buying us another 50 years for the transition). What surprised me is that I can cover double my two-car-owning European family's carbon footprint via planting trees in the UK at an annual cost of around $400. It'll cost half that to do the same in a developing country. We need a global carbon tax and we need…

> sleepwalk into oblivion

Tell that to the Egyptians, Romans, Easter-Islanders (debated now, actually), and the countless other human civilisations who didn't really appreciate their impending demise before it was too late. Hell, the Romans hired essentially barbarians (so mercenaries, basically) to defend the northern territories against...you guessed it, barbarians.

Just because the bulk of the harmful effects that humans contribute to begin at 50+ years, conveniently after humans have to live through it. Humans still create children to suffer through the hell they created though, how peculiar.