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Developments in tech in Toronto over the past seven years

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Re: Developments in tech in Toronto over the past seven years

#11

Post by tpurves »

devoply wrote: post #3
Apocryphon wrote: post #2

Is this truly significant, or is it spin to sell a city? Not to be harsh, but I've read the accounts of Canadian expats on the comparatively low wages back home. Not SF low, but low even compared to other cities in the U.S.

In Canada, salaries for tech seem to normally max out around 100k for developers (with exceptions for working for big US/multinational companies like Amazon, MSFT, etc.). Even 80k is pretty common for senior developers... In Canadian dollars. So around 80k USD is max a Canadian developer can expect to make other than a few unusual cases thrown in there which might go as high as 130k CAD so around 100k USD is a stella…

This is also why, as a founder, it's very attractive to raise US/global money but build a team in Canada. For developers for your dollar, diversity of talent, high quality education, healthcare, proximity to the US + ease of travel and immegration from the rest of the world, Canada is a great place these days to start a dev team. It's just so much harder now to build, grow and retain a dev team in SV anymore.

Re: Developments in tech in Toronto over the past seven years

#12

Post by digianarchist »

canada_dry wrote: post #6

As a Canadian tech guy who travels to Silicon Valley and Seattle fairly frequently the impression that most US techies have is that Toronto is an awesome place to live, but it is not (yet) a magnet for top talent. There are many amazing startups at any given moment in Toronto... but many of the folks involved have their sights set on FANG.

Not hard to see why.

I just jumped jobs in Toronto and I found it very hard to find a job that pays $120k+ CAD, a developer with 6+ years of experience.

Re: Developments in tech in Toronto over the past seven years

#14

Post by tlear »

devoply wrote: post #3
Apocryphon wrote: post #2

Is this truly significant, or is it spin to sell a city? Not to be harsh, but I've read the accounts of Canadian expats on the comparatively low wages back home. Not SF low, but low even compared to other cities in the U.S.

In Canada, salaries for tech seem to normally max out around 100k for developers (with exceptions for working for big US/multinational companies like Amazon, MSFT, etc.). Even 80k is pretty common for senior developers... In Canadian dollars. So around 80k USD is max a Canadian developer can expect to make other than a few unusual cases thrown in there which might go as high as 130k CAD so around 100k USD is a stella…

100k? maybe 5-6 years ago, it is not the case anymore at all. I dont what the max is but 140-150 is no that unusual(for senior people obviously)

Re: Developments in tech in Toronto over the past seven years

#15

Post by paulie_a »

canada_dry wrote: post #6

As a Canadian tech guy who travels to Silicon Valley and Seattle fairly frequently the impression that most US techies have is that Toronto is an awesome place to live, but it is not (yet) a magnet for top talent. There are many amazing startups at any given moment in Toronto... but many of the folks involved have their sights set on FANG.

I am not familiar with Toronto personally but it would have one huge benefit over silicon valley...you don't have to live in silicon valley.

Edit: I'd prefer Siberia over sv, there is a reason talented people are getting the hell out of there and many major companies are building huge offices elsewhere.

Re: Developments in tech in Toronto over the past seven years

#16

Post by acchow »

Apocryphon wrote: post #2

Is this truly significant, or is it spin to sell a city? Not to be harsh, but I've read the accounts of Canadian expats on the comparatively low wages back home. Not SF low, but low even compared to other cities in the U.S.

Toronto has the best spin department in the world. I never stop seeing listicles with Toronto in the top 3, reading about how great it is a place to live and work, and how it's become a leader in innovation/tech/art/music/film/finance.

The endless fluff pieces are a bit tiresome.

Re: Developments in tech in Toronto over the past seven years

#17

Post by thinkingkong »

kirbypineapple wrote: post #13

The wages in Toronto are laughable. In the praries it's possible to make maybe 10 to 20k less than Toronto salaries but the houses are half the price.

This is a Canada wide problem. Rather, Id even say its a !valley problem. Canadian businesses keep making this weird assumption that theres some kind of market capture but it’s really only true for people who have to stay in the city or country for some reason. The addressable hirable market is the people who chose / have to stay and havent realized being employed by a US business is as easy as switching github organizations and slack teams.

Re: Developments in tech in Toronto over the past seven years

#18

Post by adamgravitis »

Toronto’s tech talent is keen... but relatively green. Since few companies have had to deal with scaling networks, users and data to the same magnitude as is common with Valley companies, it’s almost impossible to find senior engineers worthy of the title. Plenty of options for junior and intermediate, though.

Re: Developments in tech in Toronto over the past seven years

#19

Post by kevintb »

devoply wrote: post #3
Apocryphon wrote: post #2

Is this truly significant, or is it spin to sell a city? Not to be harsh, but I've read the accounts of Canadian expats on the comparatively low wages back home. Not SF low, but low even compared to other cities in the U.S.

In Canada, salaries for tech seem to normally max out around 100k for developers (with exceptions for working for big US/multinational companies like Amazon, MSFT, etc.). Even 80k is pretty common for senior developers... In Canadian dollars. So around 80k USD is max a Canadian developer can expect to make other than a few unusual cases thrown in there which might go as high as 130k CAD so around 100k USD is a stella…

100k? You’re either massively underpaid or badly misinformed, or both. Several friends living in Toronto make 120k+ and they’re certainly not senior or management. (All in their twenties). And that’s only for homegrown startups - Amazon, etc pay very respectable salaries, especially when you factor the lower cost of living compared to the Bay Area.

Re: Developments in tech in Toronto over the past seven years

#20

Post by Apocryphon »

acchow wrote: post #16
Apocryphon wrote: post #2

Is this truly significant, or is it spin to sell a city? Not to be harsh, but I've read the accounts of Canadian expats on the comparatively low wages back home. Not SF low, but low even compared to other cities in the U.S.

Toronto has the best spin department in the world. I never stop seeing listicles with Toronto in the top 3, reading about how great it is a place to live and work, and how it's become a leader in innovation/tech/art/music/film/finance. The endless fluff pieces are a bit tiresome.

How about Montréal?
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