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Atom 1.29

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Re: Atom 1.29

#41

Post by matt4077 »

saagarjha wrote: post #7

I see a GIF of someone going deleting a couple lines of code, with a meter showing that the application is maintaining 60 FPS. Was this not something Atom could do before? It seems to me that the bare minimum should be maintaining 60 FPS while performing basic editing tasks…is there some nuance here I'm missing?

That really depends on what you measure by "frame rate".

In a single-threaded setup, maintaining 60fps is likely impossible. You may think of "just deleting a few lines of code" as trivial. But syntax highlighting alone requires re-parsing, as will automated formatting, type inference, and whatever else we expect today. It's unlikely for this to be done within the 16ms frame budget.

If you're offloading such work to separate threads, you can draw the frame right away and maintain 60fps. But you won't be able to update all the meta-information and frequently see "flashes of unstyled code".

Re: Atom 1.29

#42

Post by pjmlp »

josteink wrote: post #29
pjmlp wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We just use Vim or Emacs over SSH in such cases, or if the connection is good enough over X/RDP.

With Emacs you use it locally and edit via tramp.

I never heard of tramp, thanks.

Re: Atom 1.29

#43

Post by DC-3 »

oblio wrote: post #35
omeid2 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find the whole trend very childish and unprofessional. Why? Because emojis don't convey much meaning and borders on child-talk, worst yet, they're very vague and so makes for very poor and unprofessional form of communication.

Assuming we're talking about commit messages and such, you're probably right. But in day-to-day chats they're useful. Text is extremely bad at conveying emotion and nuance. Stuff like humor, sarcasm, irony is really hard to transmit, especially with more people. A well placed emoji/smiley can help.

I agree with this. I'm certainly not averse to dropping a :-) or emoji equivalent when appropriate. But emoji party hats every time a PR is merged, or READMEs covered with emoji, or worse of all, CLIs that use emoji in them are annoying to me and I don't understand the appeal.

Re: Atom 1.29

#44

Post by simias »

omeid2 wrote: post #28
DC-3 wrote: post #9

Honest question: can someone explain why everyone loves emoji these days, especially with regards to 'modern' programming communities such as those around JS and Rust? Is it just a celebration of the fact that we have Unicode support everywhere now?

I find the whole trend very childish and unprofessional. Why? Because emojis don't convey much meaning and borders on child-talk, worst yet, they're very vague and so makes for very poor and unprofessional form of communication.

I never use emojis (I'm not even sure how people manage to input them on a keyboard, I assume they're using mobile devices?) but I try to avoid the kneejerk reaction of hating on them, they're mostly harmless. It's very tempting to go on a "back in my days we couldn't even put accents in commit messages" rant but in the end it doesn't really matter.

If it makes writing commit messages more fun and it means that people will make more of an effort to come up with descriptive messages then I say amazing. I can't count the number of open source projects where people write absolutely useless commit messages, even coming from projects I respect. I'll take emojis over "several changes, new stuff" or "some other small fixes" (to quote actual commits from an open source project I've been hacking on lately).

Of course both things are largely unrelated but I just wanted to point out that there's not a very strong "commit etiquette" in the hacker community as of today, it's not like much of value will be lost by letting kids use emojis in them, and maybe a little could be gained.

Re: Atom 1.29

#45

Post by matt4077 »

omeid2 wrote: post #28
DC-3 wrote: post #9

Honest question: can someone explain why everyone loves emoji these days, especially with regards to 'modern' programming communities such as those around JS and Rust? Is it just a celebration of the fact that we have Unicode support everywhere now?

I find the whole trend very childish and unprofessional. Why? Because emojis don't convey much meaning and borders on child-talk, worst yet, they're very vague and so makes for very poor and unprofessional form of communication.

I can't really see how emojis are "vague", or ambiguous. And even if: ambiguity is a great feature in any form of communication, by allowing us, for example, to express criticism early and subtle, defusing social problems before they blow up.

I also think you're placing to much value on some vague notion of "professionalism" which seems to exclude all emotion and any fun.

"Professionalism" in this sense stymies business success by, for example, prohibiting the effective means of communication people choose for themselves with some nebulous argument to appearances.

Re: Atom 1.29

#46

Post by vertex-four »

DC-3 wrote: post #34
omeid2 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find the whole trend very childish and unprofessional. Why? Because emojis don't convey much meaning and borders on child-talk, worst yet, they're very vague and so makes for very poor and unprofessional form of communication.

I agree that they are unprofessional. As far as I can determine, some people feel that they make a project or community seem more inclusive or welcoming - goals which I definitely consider worthwhile. But I don't personally feel that they are helpful in this persuit. Who are you trying to be inclusive of, seven year olds?

Outside of your friend group, most of us have been using smileys and emoticons in day-to-day chat for years - the presence of rich emoticons used to set messenger platforms aside from each other - and emojis are simply the latest generation of that. They’re primarily useful for providing some emotional context to some text - and whether displaying emotion is professional or not is really down to personal preference.

Re: Atom 1.29

#47

Post by matt4077 »

saagarjha wrote: post #14
DC-3 wrote: post #9

Honest question: can someone explain why everyone loves emoji these days, especially with regards to 'modern' programming communities such as those around JS and Rust? Is it just a celebration of the fact that we have Unicode support everywhere now?

I think the goal is adding a sense of lightheartedness and by humanizing code in general, which has historically had the perception of being dry.

I don't think it has an explicit "goal", as in someone wondering "How can my code appear more humanizing?"

It's just that people somehow enjoy this new new dimension of expression in text-only media. It has long been pretty obvious that text lacks the subtlety of face-to-face or voice interactions, and that many problems stem from people misjudging the intended tone of writing. Emojis, while imperfect, may help ;)

Re: Atom 1.29

#48

Post by omeid2 »

simias wrote: post #44
omeid2 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find the whole trend very childish and unprofessional. Why? Because emojis don't convey much meaning and borders on child-talk, worst yet, they're very vague and so makes for very poor and unprofessional form of communication.

I never use emojis (I'm not even sure how people manage to input them on a keyboard, I assume they're using mobile devices?) but I try to avoid the kneejerk reaction of hating on them, they're mostly harmless. It's very tempting to go on a "back in my days we couldn't even put accents in commit messages" rant but in the end it doesn't really matter. If it makes writing commit messages more fun and it means that peopl…

> they're mostly harmless.

I don't believe that, the confusion around the meaning of emojis are well established[0][1][2][3].

I strongly suspect that the confusion and vagueness is even more predominant in professional communications than personal. Please consider that everyday the likelihood of someone reading your code who is from a different culture or context is even higher, somethings might seem obvious to us, but that is not necessarily objectively so.

If you think I am making an argument for using plain and simple language and not just avoid emoji, you're right, that is the point.

From a pure economic point of view, considering the arguably nonexistence value emojis provide, any risk or cost is too much.

0. https://www.businessinsider.com/science-reveals-the-most-con...

1. http://fortune.com/2016/04/14/emoji-miscommunication-study-u...

2. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-3549376/Frust...

3. https://www.mrporter.com/journal/modern-problems/the-most-co...

Re: Atom 1.29

#49

Post by type0 »

oblio wrote: post #35
omeid2 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find the whole trend very childish and unprofessional. Why? Because emojis don't convey much meaning and borders on child-talk, worst yet, they're very vague and so makes for very poor and unprofessional form of communication.

Assuming we're talking about commit messages and such, you're probably right. But in day-to-day chats they're useful. Text is extremely bad at conveying emotion and nuance. Stuff like humor, sarcasm, irony is really hard to transmit, especially with more people. A well placed emoji/smiley can help.

> talking about commit messages

I heard that for some folks it makes it easier to find the right commits, unfortunately it's the opposite of being inclusive because other collaborators can become easily distracted by them.

Re: Atom 1.29

#50

Post by bschwindHN »

omeid2 wrote: post #28
DC-3 wrote: post #9

Honest question: can someone explain why everyone loves emoji these days, especially with regards to 'modern' programming communities such as those around JS and Rust? Is it just a celebration of the fact that we have Unicode support everywhere now?

I find the whole trend very childish and unprofessional. Why? Because emojis don't convey much meaning and borders on child-talk, worst yet, they're very vague and so makes for very poor and unprofessional form of communication.

You sound like a very Serious and Professional Adult, feel free to ignore our Fisher-Price word-pictures.
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