The .ly domain space to be considered unsafe • Hacker News Board

Re: The .ly domain space to be considered unsafe

#151

Post by kijeda » Wed, Oct 06, 2010, 8:45 PM UTC

citricsquid wrote: post #126

pg wrote: post #93

I think what really happened here is that someone at the Libyan domain authority decided they wanted the name and made up a story in order to seize it. I've heard of other cases of .ly names being confiscated, and for this reason we advise YC startups not to depend on them.

Does this not apply to all ccTLDs though? My understanding was that the majority of ccTLDs are controlled in a way that they are able to easily "reclaim" any domain they want at any time without breaking any "rules"...

Each ccTLD is delegated to a competent operator within the country it is designated. In almost all cases (except some historic ones) this is to an entity with approval of the national government of the country. They in turn set their own regulations on domain eligibility criteria, pricing and so forth.

So when you buy a .ME domain, you are subject to the relevant law and regulation of Montenegro, for .CO in Colombia, for .LY in Libya and so forth. If those countries elect to allow registrations outside their borders, that is their choice, but there is no external regulation on how they do that. They are accountable internally to the local Internet community of the country, and the local laws.

ICANN, on the other hand, is responsible for regulating many aspects for generic top-level domains (currently TLDs with 3 or more characters, such as .COM, .NET, .INFO).

Re: The .ly domain space to be considered unsafe

#152

Post by vog » Wed, Oct 06, 2010, 9:15 PM UTC

elliottcarlson wrote: post #72

vog wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> registering a .nl domain for example requires me to jump through all kinds of hoops, and is more expensive to boot This is quite interesting, because in Germany we have the exact opposite. Here, .de domains are preferable to .com/.net/.org, because .de domains are cheaper, registered more quickly with less bureaucracy and provide better data privacy for the domain holder.

I own both a German .de as well as a .nl from the Netherlands and the hoops I had to jump to get the German domain was insane while the .nl took the same effort as registering a standard .com for me.

What "hoops" are you talking about? The domain holder doesn't even have to specify an email address or telephone number (in contrast to .com), and the domains are usually registered within less than a minute.

Re: The .ly domain space to be considered unsafe

#153

Post by kaerast » Wed, Oct 06, 2010, 9:47 PM UTC

swombat wrote: post #146

pg wrote: post #93

I think what really happened here is that someone at the Libyan domain authority decided they wanted the name and made up a story in order to seize it. I've heard of other cases of .ly names being confiscated, and for this reason we advise YC startups not to depend on them.

Alternative explanation: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1765420 "Violet Blue is an adult site".

Yes, and that's the reason given for this domain name being reclaimed. Drinking alcohol and women showing bare arms are both illegal under Sharia law, and the front page showed Violet Blue drinking beer and showing bare arms. It's difficult for many foreigners to know exactly what is and isn't legal under Sharia law, so it's difficult to know if a domain would be ok or not.

However nic.ly are now also warning they don't allow ownership of short .ly domains by foreigners, only Libyan nationals. This sounds to me like they want more money or an excuse to take down domains they simply don't like, but is a real problem if they ever decided they want in on the bit.ly action.

The vb.ly site owners keep claiming that the content may be adult but that the domain name isn't. This is a weak argument in my mind, and I believe there's a precedent of domain names registered exclusively for the act of malware propagation being taken down.

Re: The .ly domain space to be considered unsafe

#154

Post by jonhendry » Wed, Oct 06, 2010, 9:56 PM UTC

kaerast wrote: post #153

swombat wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Alternative explanation: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1765420 "Violet Blue is an adult site".

Yes, and that's the reason given for this domain name being reclaimed. Drinking alcohol and women showing bare arms are both illegal under Sharia law, and the front page showed Violet Blue drinking beer and showing bare arms. It's difficult for many foreigners to know exactly what is and isn't legal under Sharia law, so it's difficult to know if a domain would be ok or not. However nic.ly are now also warning they do…

Sharia law doesn't necessarily enter into it.

You can't sell dildos and vibrators in Texas, and it's not because of Sharia law.

Hindu activists in India made death threats and stormed theaters because of a film about a lesbian relationship.

Sharia law is not the only reason for repressive attitudes toward sex.

I mean, really. They're, what, 30-40 years behind the cultural norms of the US, in this case? You don't really need to pin that on Sharia, when it's far more likely that it's just cultural.

It wasn't that long ago in the US that nothing was open on Sundays.

Re: The .ly domain space to be considered unsafe

#155

Post by jonhendry » Wed, Oct 06, 2010, 10:00 PM UTC

jacoblyles wrote: post #148

kloncks wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I will only comment on your use of the term Sharia law. The term's widely misunderstood, especially after the events in NYC this summer. Just so that you know, Sharia "law" is just six principles: 1. The right to the protection of life. 2. The right to the protection of family. 3. The right to the protection of education. 4. The right to the protection of religion. 5. The right to the protection of property (access t…

I feel the need to fact-check this. Wikipedia's explanation of Sharia is more complex than what you say: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sharia . Perhaps you could share why you think Wikipedia is wrong? The article states: "Sharia (Arabic شريعة Šarīʿa; [ʃaˈriːʕa], "way" or "path") is the sacred law of Islam. Muslims believe Sharia is derived from two primary Sources of Islamic law; namely, the divine revelations set fo…

"Perhaps you could share why you think Wikipedia is wrong? "

Sharia is a topic of highly emotional argument right now, with lots of bigotry, ignorance, and fear-mongering. That's enough reason to suspect Wikipedia might be wrong.

Wikipedia is terrible on anything like that. On things nobody much cares about, like the history of the Marvel villain MODOK, it's great.

Re: The .ly domain space to be considered unsafe

#156

Post by jonhendry » Wed, Oct 06, 2010, 10:03 PM UTC

azim wrote: post #107

InclinedPlane wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is this at all representative of the way sharia exists in practice? Can you provide, say, 5 examples of Islamic countries practicing sharia according to this strict interpretation that aren't overwhelmed by the influence of religous and ethnic traditionalism? If not then aren't you just arguing semantics? If the way sharia is practiced conforms to a certain well delineated set of patterns and that differs from some i…

I think you're misunderstanding what is meant by Sharia. It is not a strict set of rules. Because of this, it is necessarily influenced by ethnic traditionalism. Now if you're looking for western countries which have Sharia courts, the United Kingdom and India are two which come to mind which allow certain civil disputes to be resolved in Sharia courts.

The UK also has Jewish courts.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/7233040.stm

Re: The .ly domain space to be considered unsafe

#157

Post by kloncks » Wed, Oct 06, 2010, 10:05 PM UTC

jacoblyles wrote: post #148

kloncks wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I will only comment on your use of the term Sharia law. The term's widely misunderstood, especially after the events in NYC this summer. Just so that you know, Sharia "law" is just six principles: 1. The right to the protection of life. 2. The right to the protection of family. 3. The right to the protection of education. 4. The right to the protection of religion. 5. The right to the protection of property (access t…

I feel the need to fact-check this. Wikipedia's explanation of Sharia is more complex than what you say: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sharia . Perhaps you could share why you think Wikipedia is wrong? The article states: "Sharia (Arabic شريعة Šarīʿa; [ʃaˈriːʕa], "way" or "path") is the sacred law of Islam. Muslims believe Sharia is derived from two primary Sources of Islamic law; namely, the divine revelations set fo…

Sharia law is based on two things:

1. Things from the Qur'an 2. Things from the Hadith (sayings of the Prophet)

-------------

Modern Sharia law is based on three things:

1. Qur'an 2. Hadith 3. Fiqh (which is the interpretations)

-----

That's the issue. The Fiqh part is very different from region to region and from sect to sect. Often, the really obscure laws that are brought up in arguments (take female genital mutilation for example) are often part of the Fiqh than the Sharia. That's also why, like I mentioned before, "Sharia" can be very different in Egypt compared to in Saudi Arabia.

Re: The .ly domain space to be considered unsafe

#158

Post by JangoSteve » Wed, Oct 06, 2010, 10:06 PM UTC

seldo wrote: post #99

andybak wrote: post #75

Am I the only person hoping that a high profile URL shortener liky bit.ly get taken offline so people learn quickly that redirecting their content's URLs through a 3rd party is a bad idea?

Redirecting your content through a third party like Amazon Web Services? Or Akamai CDN? Or Rackspace? All small- to medium-size websites are the result of dozens of third party companies -- server farms, network backbones, DNS providers -- working together. Even the really gigantic sites like Google and Yahoo, who really do own their whole networks and all their hardware, use third party services extensively. In the…

There's a difference between using a 3rd-party service that provides a value to help deliver your site to your audience more effectively, and using a URL shortener that obscures your site and adds no value to your delivery.

Using a URL shortener also means if that URL shortener ever goes down or out, you just lost all those links to your site.

Re: The .ly domain space to be considered unsafe

#159

Post by jacoblyles » Wed, Oct 06, 2010, 10:25 PM UTC

jonhendry wrote: post #155

jacoblyles wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel the need to fact-check this. Wikipedia's explanation of Sharia is more complex than what you say: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sharia . Perhaps you could share why you think Wikipedia is wrong? The article states: "Sharia (Arabic شريعة Šarīʿa; [ʃaˈriːʕa], "way" or "path") is the sacred law of Islam. Muslims believe Sharia is derived from two primary Sources of Islamic law; namely, the divine revelations set fo…

"Perhaps you could share why you think Wikipedia is wrong? " Sharia is a topic of highly emotional argument right now, with lots of bigotry, ignorance, and fear-mongering. That's enough reason to suspect Wikipedia might be wrong. Wikipedia is terrible on anything like that. On things nobody much cares about, like the history of the Marvel villain MODOK, it's great.

There is such a big difference between the claim that Sharia means six very non-controversial universal values (which the original poster claims) and that Sharia is a system of law based on Islamic beliefs as refined and interpreted by Muslim holy men, that I believe we ought to be able to determine which statement is closer to the truth regardless of interfering emotion. I suspect the original poster is being disingenuous by portraying Sharia law as such a bland and harmless thing.

Re: The .ly domain space to be considered unsafe

#160

Post by endlessvoid94 » Wed, Oct 06, 2010, 10:26 PM UTC

endlessvoid94 wrote: post #121

seldo wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Redirecting your content through a third party like Amazon Web Services? Or Akamai CDN? Or Rackspace? All small- to medium-size websites are the result of dozens of third party companies -- server farms, network backbones, DNS providers -- working together. Even the really gigantic sites like Google and Yahoo, who really do own their whole networks and all their hardware, use third party services extensively. In the…

I think he's talking about how URL shorteners undermine a bit of the effectiveness and utility of REST. All resources should be clear and readable, etc. URL shorteners remove useful information.

I usually don't care if I'm downvoted, but usually I can figure out the reason.

The HN community has become pretty watered down lately. Yuck.