Good! Next I hope they pass a law requiring all guys to compliment the homely wallflower once a day and not just mack on the hot chicks.
To the barricades!
Bay Area cities are cracking down on free food at tech companies
71–80 of 533 posts
Re: Bay Area cities are cracking down on free food at tech companies
#72California's found a unique way to incorporate only the shitty parts of European socialism without adding in any of the massive benefits. We get the same high taxes and restrictive overreaching laws without any of the free healthcare, free university tuition, or pension plans.
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Re: Bay Area cities are cracking down on free food at tech companies
#73This is very interesting, I had never considered the impact free food at a large office has on its surroundings. The legislation certainly sounds backwards, but to me the situation is reminiscent of a company using profits from one sector to subsidize another, in order to drown out competitors in that space. I don't think Facebook is actually trying to kill off restaurants, but this is definitely how you would do it…
I don't see what's anticompetitive about it - surely they buy the food they give out from local retailers?
A food wholesaler and a restaurant are two entirely different businesses.
Re: Bay Area cities are cracking down on free food at tech companies
#74I was not surprised when I read the headline, but I was surprised when I saw the reason when I read the article.
I had expected it would be over taxes.
From the photos and description in the article and elsewhere, it looks like you can get full meals for free, meals that would cost at least $10 if bought at retail.
An employee who took two meals a day at the free company cafeteria every working day would be getting a benefit worth almost $5000/year. That's equivalent to something like an extra $8000/year salary.
I believe that food provided to employees is normally not taxable for the employee, and is actually deductible as a business expense by the employer (but I've not looked into how the recent major tax changes may have affected that), but I think that was intended for things like where employees have to remain available for emergencies during meal periods, or where meal breaks are too short to allow employees time to go get food, and things like that.
The term of art is that the meals have to be provided for the employer's convenience. In the short meal break case, for example, providing meals is for the employer's convenience because it saves them from having to offer longer meal breaks.
Meals offered for things like goodwill, morale, or attracting employees are not considered to be for the employer's convenience, but are still OK if they are de minimis. So things like donuts, soft drinks, meals when employees have to take occasional overtime, the occasional company party or picnic, and things like that are fine.
Putting in a cafeteria that offers free full meals to all employees all the time probably is not de minimis. It may not actually violate tax laws, but if it does not it is pushing the limits hard so I'd certainly not be surprised to see attempts to crack down from that angle.
Re: Bay Area cities are cracking down on free food at tech companies
#75A place that I worked (not in the bay area) had a cafeteria where employees could eat one meal for free per workday by using a meal ticket. They also cut deals with nearby restaurants so the meal tickets could be used as basically $5 vouchers at the restaurants. That seemed like an OK compromise. Not sure how it worked behind the scenes.
Why should there even be a "compromise"? My employer gives me free health care. Should that be restricted so I have to spend my own dollars and not get the benefit of a group plan? Should employers not be allowed to give a transit subsidy because it hurts Lyft/Uber? Maybe tech companies should not be allowed to offer stock based compensation because it's unfair to other city residents who work jobs without such thing…
Honestly as an employee it felt like a win all around. If I was tired of the office or my co workers I could go somewhere else. Tried a lot of restaurants I wouldn't have otherwise, so great for them. And the company didn't have to scale their cafeteria as fast as they might have otherwise when hiring.
Re: Bay Area cities are cracking down on free food at tech companies
#76as someone who works in a place a solid few miles from restaurants, and has a break room with a few microwaves/a toaster oven as well as a vending machine with gas station tier food... how common are workplace cafeterias like this? is it just sv megacompanies or is it smaller firms across the country?
I work for a medium sized company in the commercial insurance space in PA. We have a cafeteria. They do charge for meals, but we have access to unlimited drinks. I think larger companies in general will have a cafeteria of some kind, but free food is very much a perk of software companies on the whole, I do believe.
i don't even mind charging for meals, but not having to spend most of my lunch break driving for easy food would be a huge plus. guess i know what to look for once i graduate.
Re: Bay Area cities are cracking down on free food at tech companies
#77Much easier for city councils to virtue signal on non issues rather than tackling the sea of needles and shit on their sidewalks.
Agree. Another reason why I'm sure some don't want to walk outside. You lose your appetite pretty quick seeing needles and poop everywhere.
Re: Bay Area cities are cracking down on free food at tech companies
#78How about Tech companies spin out their Cafe and require their worker to pay for it? The companies would have owned the property, and making the meal cost at least 30% cheaper.
That's pretty similar to what Microsoft does with its myriad Cafés on campus. The food seemed cheaper than a restaurant, as if they charge for labor + ingredients. You could only order there as an employee or guest of an employee, though.
Re: Bay Area cities are cracking down on free food at tech companies
#79These cities really are trying their hardest to kill their golden goose.
Re: Bay Area cities are cracking down on free food at tech companies
#80This is very interesting for me for a very different reason:
We're in Germany where this is taxed heavily. If you offer your employees free meals, this becomes part of their taxable income, so you actually have to give them a raise to even this out, and then you have employees that want to opt-out to get the hands on that cash...
I always wondered how Google Germany deals with this. There is a minimum below which it doesn't get taxed and specific items like coffee, water etc fall out of this, but it blew my mind the first time I was trying to set something like this up for our company.