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Founders who can't code

news.ycombinator.com

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Re: Founders who can't code

#31

Post by mortenjorck »

edw519 wrote: post #25

You will NOT become an engineer, programmer, or web developer, but you will be able to put a prototype of your idea together and maybe get one or two beta users for feedback... You will also be able to have an intelligent conversation with a developer. I get sad whenever I encounter a business person with no technical bullshit filter. Not because I'm judging them, but because if I can bullshit them, any other develop…

I've been trying to learn enough Objective-C and Cocoa to be able to communicate at some level with a future co-founder (or even a contractor if I can find one within my bootstrap budget). It's slow going, though, and a first-mover just launched—the hardest question now seems to be just how much of the territory I want to be familiar with before I take the next step.

But I think you have a good benchmark there: Do I know it well enough yet to have a good idea of when I'm being bullshitted?

Re: Founders who can't code

#32

Post by bherms »

I wrote a blog post related to this yesterday. I agree with the author 100%. I can't remember how many times some business guy tried to pitch me on some stupid idea without an inkling of knowledge about programming or how the web works. The worst part is that they generally have no money either. If you have a good idea with some idea of how to implement it and a clear vision, you may be able to sell me. If you have a half-assed idea and are just trying to jump on the internet millions bandwagon because you think it doesn't involve real work, go to hell.

Re: Founders who can't code

#33

Post by jbarham »

FWIW Jason Fried, one of the original founders of 37signals, still doesn't know how to program (http://37signals.com/svn/posts/2540-no-more-drive-by-teachin...) but that obviously hasn't prevented the company from being a success. But then 37signals started off as a web design firm, and he had the good fortune to hire DHH.

Re: Founders who can't code

#34

Post by zavulon »

I know this is a popular opinion here, but I couldn't disagree more. You're saying that it's good for everyone to try to learn to code. Far from it. Some people are just not cut out to be coders, they suck at it, they hate doing it, and they don't WANT to do it. More than half of my intro CS class was just like that, and they dropped out.

If you're a non-technical founder, and have money, it's perfectly ok for you to hire a developer or a team to implement your idea (full disclosure - I run a company that does that, link in profile) instead of learning how to program yourself. Here's a very good article by Derek Sivers on steps you could take to make that happen: http://sivers.org/how2hire

Re: Founders who can't code

#35

Post by eLod »

I strongly disagree. Learn code if you are interested, but what ill advice is that you have to learn code?! Consider your advice from a designer perspective, should founders/coders learn design because "worst case scenario, your future designer partner will respect you for trying, ...". The same goes for scaling, you should stop and learn how to scale if you're a front-end developer because the reasons you gave?

Re: Founders who can't code

#36

Post by speby »

I think this is a very common problem in any business. If I want to start a restaurant, and I'm a "business guy" I could maybe try to find a "chef" co-founder, which many people obviously do when they start restaurants, however if I know little to nothing about the culinary arts, food preparation, and what kind of cuisines matter to people in a specific area, my "skills" as a business person are of limited utility and give me no competitive advantage over the dozens of other restaurants in the area I'm trying to start one in.

This very same pattern is the same in many other industries, not just software. But I couldn't agree more. Know your domain knowledge.

Re: Founders who can't code

#37

Post by alnayyir »

jbarham wrote: post #33

FWIW Jason Fried, one of the original founders of 37signals, still doesn't know how to program ( http://37signals.com/svn/posts/2540-no-more-drive-by-teachin... ) but that obviously hasn't prevented the company from being a success. But then 37signals started off as a web design firm, and he had the good fortune to hire DHH.

I think Fried is sharp enough to identify talent and bullshit anyway, so he overcame the necessity of this advice through that and the fact that the above advice isn't entirely applicable to his case.

Re: Founders who can't code

#38

Post by trustfundbaby »

alnayyir wrote: post #37
jbarham wrote: post #33

FWIW Jason Fried, one of the original founders of 37signals, still doesn't know how to program ( http://37signals.com/svn/posts/2540-no-more-drive-by-teachin... ) but that obviously hasn't prevented the company from being a success. But then 37signals started off as a web design firm, and he had the good fortune to hire DHH.

I think Fried is sharp enough to identify talent and bullshit anyway, so he overcame the necessity of this advice through that and the fact that the above advice isn't entirely applicable to his case.

wait. what!?!?

Re: Founders who can't code

#39

Post by alnayyir »

trustfundbaby wrote: post #38
alnayyir wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think Fried is sharp enough to identify talent and bullshit anyway, so he overcame the necessity of this advice through that and the fact that the above advice isn't entirely applicable to his case.

wait. what!?!?

Do you have a specific part of that, that you take exception with?

Replies like "wait. what?!" don't actually contribute to the conversation on YC.News and are functionally, pollution.

Also don't use downvotes as an "I disagree" weapon, but rather a way to cull commentary that isn't contributing to the exchange.

Much like your own, actually.

Confer with http://ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

In the "In Comments" section for more info if you haven't reviewed it already.

Thank you.

Re: Founders who can't code

#40

Post by QuantumGood »

So the reason is to 1. Create a prototype, and 2. Get respect from developers.

Re: #2—Let's reverse this, specifically for marketing.

Developers (and pretty much anyone) who know a little marketing can be harder to work with than those that believe they don't understand it. They over-rely on cliches and stereotypes without realizing it.

And what about the scenario where you end up with a person with limited technical knowledge micro-managing a tech worker? Not a good thing.

Re: #1—I find creating mock-ups shows functionality more accurately and in much, much less time than creating working prototypes.

I'm a business/marketing guy who loves coding. I usually avoid it because it's incredibly time-consuming to do even half-assed well, and you can re-use little of what you learn when it's just a one-off experience to creating something to show. (I realize that if you are always learning and creating things, your experience builds in more reusable ways.)

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