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Apple releases software fix for MacBook Pro slowdown

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Re: Apple releases software fix for MacBook Pro slowdown

#191

Post by temac »

breatheoften wrote: post #145
opencl wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple always claims their issues affect a small number of units. I have seen zero people that tested the i9 MBP and did not see major throttling. The issue is clearly the result of a fundamental defect in how they were managing power and thermals.

The official explanation seems to be that the key management defect which lead to thermal management problems did not occur in the development machines used during the engineering process. This seems possible as presumably every machine used internally goes through a different provisioning process than those released into customer hands ... Thus the claimed cause of the problem seems to indicate that the flaw did not…

Engineering, especially at this level, is not supposed to work like that. You certainly not do dev proto, then switch to prod both in one step and without even rechecking the tests you did on the proto. So their official explanation might be kind of right, but then it shows major deficiencies in their quality process.

Which given the track record of quality issues they have had, is possible.

Re: Apple releases software fix for MacBook Pro slowdown

#192

Post by temac »

GeekyBear wrote: post #173
toasterlovin wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would not trust any coverage of supposed issues with Apple hardware. There is a huge incentive for negative coverage. Remember Antenna-gate with the iPhone 4? They continued selling the iPhone 4, completely unmodified, for years after that whole debacle. That's how widespread the supposed issue was.

A more relevant example would be the Dell XPS 15 where owners and a few reviewers have reported extreme thermal throttling with i7 models. >As mentioned in our detailed review, the XPS 15 9560 with the Core i7-7700HQ processor is prone to two types of throttling: Thermal throttling of the CPU or GPU (generally the CPU) when temperatures get too high Voltage Regulator Module (VRM) throttling caused by it getting too h…

It isn't has bad as the Apple one though. But of course, Dell should also fix their shit.

Re: Apple releases software fix for MacBook Pro slowdown

#193

Post by eudora »

curiousgal wrote: post #75
ovrdrv3 wrote: post #22

Happy to see Dave2D at the forefront of this. He gives solid advice and puts out crispy 4K content on YouTube. Link to his channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCVYamHliCI9rw1tHR1xbkfw

I feel bad for the other famous YouTuber who published a video basically saying that everyone are overreacting.

Wait who?

Re: Apple releases software fix for MacBook Pro slowdown

#194

Post by posting2fast »

tomp wrote: post #125
paavoova wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You claim to be a "poweruser", but then go and speak out of pure ignorance when it comes to Linux. You say "Apple hardware is beyond superior", when in reality Apple glorifies form over function with soldered, unserviceable parts (and actively lobbies against self-repair), and removal of ports (very anti-poweruser, if you ask me), all of which turn their laptops into disposable gadgets meant for the consumer demograp…

> "Poweruser"? No, I feel the more accurate term would be power-consumer. Possibly. I guess there are many different kinds of powerusers. The interpretation I had in mind is that I use the computer (1) a lot, (2) not just for internet/media consumption, and (3) I use it to program so I want/need easy accessibility to many software packages (which is a problem on Windows, IME). Just because I can solve all of the prob…

> Possibly. I guess there are many different kinds of powerusers.

It's simply that "programmer who doesn't like to configure things in detail until everything they use fits them like a glove and doesn't know much about hardware" and "power user" are different and orthogonal things.

Re: Apple releases software fix for MacBook Pro slowdown

#195

Post by pokemongoaway »

tjr225 wrote: post #139
sgillen wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah it’s really hard to correct the perspective to the truth though if all you have is social media. Honestly I’ve been putting less and less trust in almost all my sources of knowledge recently.

It's so, so strange that 10-20 years ago my parents told me not to trust what I read on the internet...and now that they're all using it they have seem forgotten their own advice.

Yes it is exactly the same people that said "you can't trust it because it is 'from the internet'" who still now cling hardest to their trusted source of media.

Re: Apple releases software fix for MacBook Pro slowdown

#196

Post by pokemongoaway »

temac wrote: post #191
breatheoften wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The official explanation seems to be that the key management defect which lead to thermal management problems did not occur in the development machines used during the engineering process. This seems possible as presumably every machine used internally goes through a different provisioning process than those released into customer hands ... Thus the claimed cause of the problem seems to indicate that the flaw did not…

Engineering, especially at this level, is not supposed to work like that. You certainly not do dev proto, then switch to prod both in one step and without even rechecking the tests you did on the proto. So their official explanation might be kind of right, but then it shows major deficiencies in their quality process. Which given the track record of quality issues they have had, is possible.

Agreed that it's not supposed to work like that :) It didn't when I worked with much less prestigious HW companies than Apple, even.

Re: Apple releases software fix for MacBook Pro slowdown

#197

Post by GeekyBear »

temac wrote: post #192
GeekyBear wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A more relevant example would be the Dell XPS 15 where owners and a few reviewers have reported extreme thermal throttling with i7 models. >As mentioned in our detailed review, the XPS 15 9560 with the Core i7-7700HQ processor is prone to two types of throttling: Thermal throttling of the CPU or GPU (generally the CPU) when temperatures get too high Voltage Regulator Module (VRM) throttling caused by it getting too h…

It isn't has bad as the Apple one though. But of course, Dell should also fix their shit.

I'd say that a similarly priced high end laptop that cannot adequately cool a four core i7 is a bigger deal, especially given that this is their second year to ship devices with the same issue.

>The service manual for the Dell XPS 15 9570 is now available and it reveals something that we wished would improve in this generation — that the XPS 15 9570 carries over the same 2-pipe heatsink assembly from the previous generation. Not just that, there is also no indication of improved thermal dissipation from the Voltage Regulator Modules (VRMs) implying that we could be in for some serious throttling issues.

The Dell XPS 15 while earning accolades for being a very capable multimedia laptop that can also game, has also earned the reputation for throttling heavily under load. Both the earlier XPS 15s suffered from both thermal and power-limit throttling. The only way to fix this was to repaste and undervolt the CPU and also apply thermal pads on the VRMs to drive away all the excess heat.

Unfortunately, it looks like Dell has chosen to retain the existing heatsink design for the XPS 15 9570. Compounding throttling fears is the availability of a Core i9-8950HK variant.

https://www.notebookcheck.net/The-Dell-XPS-15-9570-might-inh...

You would think that after two years with the same issue, the mainstream tech press would pick up on it if the issue is throttling and not just chasing clickbait stories.

Re: Apple releases software fix for MacBook Pro slowdown

#198

Post by grecy »

joshstrange wrote: post #179
white-flame wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But how do the temperatures differ before & after the update?

That I can’t really answer, I didn’t do a ton of benchmarking other than the CPU which I had seen that jagged pattern before so to see it so smooth and not fall under base clock was all I was looking for.

Does the fan seem to run more / higher rpm now?

Re: Apple releases software fix for MacBook Pro slowdown

#199

Post by spacemonkey92 »

eudora wrote: post #193
curiousgal wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel bad for the other famous YouTuber who published a video basically saying that everyone are overreacting.

Wait who?

Jonathan Morrison (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y-p9-QZSdPM)

Re: Apple releases software fix for MacBook Pro slowdown

#200

Post by carlesfe »

exabrial wrote: post #180

Congrats to Apple for handling this correctly: not suing the guy. The bad news is this escaped your QA process. That never would have happened 10 years ago.

> That never would have happened 10 years ago

The Macbook Pro from 2008 literally had a thermal issue. It made some units not boot at all. And it required a logic board replace, not just a software fix.

https://www.ifixit.com/Wiki/MacBook_Pro_15%22_Unibody_Troubl...

"If the fans run at high RPMs, but the computer does not boot, there is probably an issue with the thermal sensors.

Late 2008/Early 2009 models feature a thermal sensor on the heat sink. First, ensure that the thermal sensor on the heat sink is plugged into the logic board. If it is, try replacing the heat sink. If this does not fix the problem, the logic board most likely needs to be replaced."

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