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Secret Life of an Autistic Stripper

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Re: Secret Life of an Autistic Stripper

#101
post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know why you point out that it's impossible to falsely diagnose cancer in a patient who has cancer. Surely you agree that it's also impossible to falsely diagnose autism in a person with autism? But perhaps your remark simply reflects a metaphor stretched too far. I realize that you are not the original commenter who alleged that the term "autism" was being thrown around too lightly, but you're happy to agree…

In my opinion, people are different. Attributing differences to disorders is not productive, and tends to lead to things such as medication and expensive treatment and therapy when such things are not only unnecessary but absurd and can even be harmful - especially in the longrun. It's reminiscent of various 'treatments' for homosexuality in the earlier years of psychology/psychiatry, which by the way does not mean t…

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17590856

This post answers yours clearly: it is a spectrum.

> I think a reasonable definition would be a disorder

Homosexuality is not a disorder according to ICD or DSM. Autism is a development disorder. Schizophrenia is a psychotic disorder. Disorders cannot be cured, and cannot be treated either. One can learn to cope with them, but it cannot go away like a traditional disease. Its a verdict for life, so to say.

Someone with autism can have other issues, on top of their autism, e.g. ADHD or depression however autism is the main issue from which the other issues derive from.

The rest of your post is just denial, and I can only speculate why.

> The definition of mental illness should not slide so far as to begin to encompass people that clearly are not ill by any meaningful definition of the word.

That's why we have specialists who analyse people, and not laymen like people themselves, or people like you who claim about random strangers they "they don't have autism" or "don't have severe enough autism". Those people who get a diagnosis by said specialists who specialised in ASD generally don't get misdiagnosed. You may safely assume that those people have ASD. If they're not a child anymore, that generally means they have a relatively mild form but as you can read throughout this thread that doesn't mean they don't suffer, or that there's no room for QoL improvements. You can figure out how adults with so-called mild autism suffer by reading into their stories. The linked story is a great anecdote though unfortunately the subject didn't get a diagnosis.

I am lucky enough to live in a relatively rich country with decent healthcare. But many in our world, including in the USA, are not as good off as I am. Those people might run around un(der)diagnosed. That saddens me, as I've been misdiagnosed and un(de)rdiagnosed myself for a good 3,5 decades.

Re: Secret Life of an Autistic Stripper

#102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it's like the cognitive part of your brain just isn't connected to the emotional part I have this problem. Most of the time I call it autism for convenience although I know it isn't accurate. Deficient/Immature emotional processing is a better phrase that is more accurate. I think that development issues in the psyche can lead to delays in areas like emotional processing and theory of mind. Oftentimes I have to sim…

I'm starting to call it "cognitive empathy". Rather than having emotions and theory of mind operate in the limbic system where they belong, and not having the option of not having an empathic center, the mind starts to build its own version of the limbic system in the forebrain. This brings the functioning of that system into the cognitive purview. It's definitely in the Cluster B 'spectrum' but in order to make sens…

> I'm starting to call it "cognitive empathy". Rather than having emotions and theory of mind operate in the limbic system where they belong, and not having the option of not having an empathic center, the mind starts to build its own version of the limbic system in the forebrain. This brings the functioning of that system into the cognitive purview.

You describe the exact model I have created for my brain as well. It's exactly this. A separate thing that simulates the activity of the limbic system, but I'm still unsure if I'm not simply reusing the limbic system for that (would need a fMRI to test this hypothesis).

> What I'm calling here 'cognitive empathy' is when the trauma doesn't really reach the point where it affects functioning.

I can't remember being traumatized, but I know that I didn't seek affection as a kid (my sister told me that hugging me etc. didn't affect me, any type of punishment didn't affect me on an emotional level - there were some autistic tendencies).

I got my IQ tested (because I misbehaved in school and teachers thought either I'm stupid or highly gifted) and got many points (got downvoted the last time I wrote that number down here). If the numbers are correct I'm part of the top 1% with my intelligence. I guess I had to pay a price for that. Are there studies that show a correlation between highly gifted kids and problems with the linking of the limbic system?

- - -

> It's their limbic system finally making connections with the forebrain.

> Empathy that's only cognitive needs to be controlled and extreme anxiety results when the control isn't maintained.

> You can look around, sense that no one is trying to judge you or anything, and start to relax.

Very accurate observation, although I can easily recognize if I get judged or if people focus on me - I wasn't able to do this in the past (people told me), but I'm getting better and I'm now on a par with "normal" people (and I have the advantage that all this information is conscious so I can act on it faster and more rational). But I also think that this is based on my forebrain. The limbic system feels something (but retrieving this information is more demanding). Normally I maintain a feeling of apatheia in my limbic system (I can control this most of the time). Once I've set the emotion, it's hard for anything (myself included) to change it. I don't even care about death in that state which is a bit dangerous (had some very dangerous situations in the past because of that) - I'm completely content, very stoic and don't feel ego in that state.

> But if all that is happening cognitively, it won't happen fast enough to keep up with the amygdala's defense mechanisms.

Sometimes I feel that I'm actively suppressing defense mechanisms because my consciousness overrides the emotional response. I think it's a matter of training. It's hard to be faster, but most of the time you get the control back pretty fast. Using knowledge of cognitive biases, human tendencies, evolutionary psychology and rationalizations are extremely helpful to achieve that.

- - -

Sometimes I let it slip and I'm positive about being able to feel something - I can remember that I was grateful that I was able to cry when one of my ex-girlfriends left me: I didn't had to and I had to convince myself, but I felt like a human being doing that. I thought: "Very good, I'm crying. Like a normal person. I'm still human". I was able to stop crying in every second, everything was very controlled - I don't know if this is normal, but this fits to your statement: "They can improve, often just by seeking out feeling wherever they can find it."

I'm trying to do that. But I have to say: My best improvements came through improving my knowledge about psychology. I'm making better predictions about human behavior and slowly it's better than most people with their intuition. I'm slowly achieving above-average insight into human nature compared to my surroundings. I use feedback loops to ensure that my assumptions are correct (not always very nice: I ask people very intimate things, bypass their emotional defenses or analyze them thoroughly). But it's the only way to be sure that I'm actually improving and not falling for self-delusion.

Re: Secret Life of an Autistic Stripper

#103

> Facial expressions, body language, and eye contact are the bones of communication and it’s quite difficult to build and maintain relationships without the ability to read them. As a blind person this was quite difficult to read (emotionally). I don't have any additional mental needs, but for obvious reasons I'm unable to read other peoples' visual body language, maintain eye contact or gauge their facial expression…

"As a blind person this was quite difficult to read" Ah shit! I need a new keyboard and cup of tea....

Re: Secret Life of an Autistic Stripper

#104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have seen studies that suggest the best war time soldiers are probably ASD or ADHD. Unsurprisingly, great war time soldiers often suck during peace time. If you read a little history, this has long been true. I read a history piece that suggested that we only had one Civil War in the US because the General that accepted Lee's surrender at Appomattox was a chronic alcoholic and ne'er-do-well who learned compassion b…

In his last years, Grant worked with Mark Twain to write his autobiography. It is pretty clear that Grant was anything but a "callous bastard" or a "monster", particularly relative to others in that time period. Indeed, many of his political and personal problems stemmed from being too willing to trust people, many of whom were unsavory characters. (Grant ended up being bankrupted after being defrauded of his savings…

I second this. Grant by Rob Chernow is an excellent audiobook. His entire life was fascinating. You’ll come away from this book with great leadership principles and a deeper understanding of US History.

Re: Secret Life of an Autistic Stripper

#105
post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And I would like to clarify that my own self-diagnosis and your reference to "The Psychopath Code" is not a reliable source of information for a diagnosis. Fair enough. > Sociopathy is very likely a spectrum disorder like autism. I'd say we're starting to understand disorders in general are. At the very least they're not binary. Even something like sexual preference such as homosexuality isn't binary. > I have kill…

One thing that's leaping out of me in the course of this discussion is just how different ASD is from Cluster B, they affect different parts of the brain for different reasons. Cluster B largely happens as a result of trauma, and individuals on the spectrum can absolutely be traumatized and so develop emotional deficiencies. But this by no means happens with everybody on that spectrum. ASD largely affects the sensory…

ASD is an element of Cluster B personality disorders.

> how different ASD is from Cluster B

is therefore like saying "how different a football is from balls". Did you mean "ASD is different from Borderline (problems with emotional regulation, panic attacks, ...), Histrionic (egocentric, seeking attention) and Narcissistic (egotistic, abusive, ...) personality disorders" in the sense that those result from trauma?

Re: Secret Life of an Autistic Stripper

#106
post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Having a mild form can be even more difficult. Yup, people with severe autism get diagnosed early in their life, as child. They're clearly impaired by their autism, and get help. People with a mild version get un(der)-diagnosed, especially women. They're expected to just blend in with society yet when they have difficulty in life, they're being told to e.g. "man up". Which might work with NTs shrug . If you don't s…

I think the real question is where is the line between it being a character trait (aloof, stoic, introverted, a bit weird, you name it) and a disability. I don't think high functioning autism is a disability, it's a character type that is a bit out there - but with the person knowing it and other people learning about it, we can all get along just fine.

> I think the real question is where is the line between it being a character trait (aloof, stoic, introverted, a bit weird, you name it) and a disability.

Yeah, that's the one billion dollar question indeed, one even specialists are unable to answer. (Both me and my significant other asked our specialists this very question.)

Autism is a (developmental) disorder. In our society you're expected to behave in a certain way, and if you don't you get burned. You get called a witch, a hermit, an oddball, a nerd, or what have you. People with mild ASD can function in our society, but there will be situations where they have to adapt to society's norms instead of their own.

If the world worked the way I'd envision, a lot of small talk simply wouldn't exist. Simple example: I get fucking annoyed by this terrible, inhumane and fake way Americans seem to greet each other with how are you which they don't mean one iota of. I cannot stand it, but I have to endure it, and the American culture is coming for you. It slowly creeps up into the world, for good or bad (not saying its all bad!). Another example: looking someone in the eye when you talk to them. I don't want to! I get over-sensitised! I prefer to stare to something beautiful peaceful, such as clouds, nature, or some one point on the wall which has a slightly different colour.

The good news is that people with mild ASD, with adequate help and understanding from their peers, can have a functional, successful life and many have bend the positive side of their ASD to something fruitful. Whether that's some scientific advancement, great invention, financial success, or a plain happiness is less relevant than it might seem.

Re: Secret Life of an Autistic Stripper

#107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm starting to call it "cognitive empathy". Rather than having emotions and theory of mind operate in the limbic system where they belong, and not having the option of not having an empathic center, the mind starts to build its own version of the limbic system in the forebrain. This brings the functioning of that system into the cognitive purview. It's definitely in the Cluster B 'spectrum' but in order to make sens…

> I'm starting to call it "cognitive empathy". Rather than having emotions and theory of mind operate in the limbic system where they belong, and not having the option of not having an empathic center, the mind starts to build its own version of the limbic system in the forebrain. This brings the functioning of that system into the cognitive purview. You describe the exact model I have created for my brain as well. I…

> My best improvements came through improving my knowledge about psychology.

Studying psychology gives you more cognitive resources, allowing your brain to wrap itself better around certain concepts. I think it's easy for intellectual types to put too much emphasis on cognitive development and they need to be encouraged to actually develop their limbic system.

The cognitive wants to get better, constantly constantly better. The limbic wants harmony. I also have had the experience of being prideful of the capacity to be emotional. Over time I've been able to gradually cede the compulsion of the cognitive to allow the limbic to do its job. It makes life much, much, much simpler, to be able to turn off the need to constantly understand everything.

Re: Secret Life of an Autistic Stripper

#108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One thing that's leaping out of me in the course of this discussion is just how different ASD is from Cluster B, they affect different parts of the brain for different reasons. Cluster B largely happens as a result of trauma, and individuals on the spectrum can absolutely be traumatized and so develop emotional deficiencies. But this by no means happens with everybody on that spectrum. ASD largely affects the sensory…

ASD is an element of Cluster B personality disorders. > how different ASD is from Cluster B is therefore like saying "how different a football is from balls". Did you mean "ASD is different from Borderline (problems with emotional regulation, panic attacks, ...), Histrionic (egocentric, seeking attention) and Narcissistic (egotistic, abusive, ...) personality disorders" in the sense that those result from trauma?

ASD (Autism Spectrum Disorder) is definitely not classed as a Cluster B personality disorder. You may be mistaking ASD for ASPD, Antisocial Personality Disorder, of which psychopathy is a variant. Sociopathy is not defined in the DSM-IV or DSM-5.

Re: Secret Life of an Autistic Stripper

#109
post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have seen studies that suggest the best war time soldiers are probably ASD or ADHD. Unsurprisingly, great war time soldiers often suck during peace time. If you read a little history, this has long been true. I read a history piece that suggested that we only had one Civil War in the US because the General that accepted Lee's surrender at Appomattox was a chronic alcoholic and ne'er-do-well who learned compassion b…

It was Ulysses S Grant, also the 18th President of United States. Fun fact, they both went to West Point and Lee graduated 2nd in his class whereas Grant was an average student at best, but during the civil war, Grant was the better tactician by most accounts and was willing to take heavy losses. Grant was an alcoholic and his presidency was riddled with corruption and his reputation was damaged by the Lost Cause rev…

I didn't say he was a monster. I said he was considered to be at the time that he was General during the Civil War. I chose that wording carefully.

In a nutshell, my understanding of the war is that Lee was a brilliant strategist and tactician and the primary advantage the North had was numbers of soldiers. Grant did not hesitate to use the only advantage he had, resulting in a high number of deaths to gain the upper hand. Lincoln had his back politically and did not replace him. Lincoln apparently believed in him.

Re: Secret Life of an Autistic Stripper

#110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm starting to call it "cognitive empathy". Rather than having emotions and theory of mind operate in the limbic system where they belong, and not having the option of not having an empathic center, the mind starts to build its own version of the limbic system in the forebrain. This brings the functioning of that system into the cognitive purview. You describe the exact model I have created for my brain as well. I…

> My best improvements came through improving my knowledge about psychology. Studying psychology gives you more cognitive resources, allowing your brain to wrap itself better around certain concepts. I think it's easy for intellectual types to put too much emphasis on cognitive development and they need to be encouraged to actually develop their limbic system. The cognitive wants to get better, constantly constantly…

> The cognitive wants to get better, constantly constantly better. The limbic wants harmony. I also have had the experience of being prideful of the capacity to be emotional. Over time I've been able to gradually cede the compulsion of the cognitive to allow the limbic to do its job. It makes life much, much, much simpler, to be able to turn off the need to constantly understand everything.

At the risk of sounding like a broken record: mindfulness can aid with that.

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