Ask HN: Got a CS degree, but I’m unable to be programmer. What can I do? • Hacker News Board

Re: Ask HN: Got a CS degree, but I’m unable to be programmer. What can I do?

#31

Post by keithnz » Mon, Jul 23, 2018, 1:33 AM UTC

Somethings wrong when someone is trying to game the interview system by trying to do programming puzzles rather than thinking that the best way to get a job is to try and write some software.

I got into programming because I like creating things, having ideas and making them happen. Algorithms like you find in programming puzzles rarely stand in your way to create things. GoogleFu / BingJitsu tends to solve most problems pretty quick.

Now your search skills often depend on what you are aware of to look for

I enjoy programming puzzles from time to time, usually advent of code, but I also don't get a huge level of satisfaction from solving those problems so I don't do them all and often just cherry pick the most interesting ones after the event is over. Often the most interesting thing is to see what techniques other people used to solve it. Which is really the key point for a professional software developer :- be aware of techniques and know what kind of problems they can be used for. Often techniques can be applied to problems in ways that are just not obvious.

So, first piece of advice, look for jobs that don't do puzzle based interviewing. Smaller companies are good targets, they don't need to do formula based recruiting ( however many do try to copy big players approaches to interviewing )

Ok, so maybe you really don't want to be a dev...but there are other specialist areas, like testing, devops, UI (Ux). But that would greatly depend on what you enjoy.

If none of it is of interest, then there is all kinds of tangential roles, recruiters, product management, HR. But may require further study.

Just work out what you really like doing

Re: Ask HN: Got a CS degree, but I’m unable to be programmer. What can I do?

#32

Post by rb808 » Mon, Jul 23, 2018, 1:35 AM UTC

Its not clear if you've actually tried applying for jobs and doing interviews, or just doing interview prep. If you haven't applied for jobs just start doing it. Grad programs would be a first start. I think you'll find its easier than you think. Sure, the big name companies will have a high bar but less well known tech companies and esp corporates really don't expect grads to know that much.

If you are getting interviews then bombing them all - then you can start to worry. If you really don't get anywhere you can try looking for QA/test jobs where you usually have to know a bit about software and end up writing scripts and maybe move into dev later with some more practice.

Re: Ask HN: Got a CS degree, but I’m unable to be programmer. What can I do?

#33

Post by taormina » Mon, Jul 23, 2018, 1:37 AM UTC

Happy to chat if you want to talk with a relatively recent grad who has done plenty of interviewing on both sides of the table. My email should be in my profile.

Re: Ask HN: Got a CS degree, but I’m unable to be programmer. What can I do?

#34

Post by r3nrut » Mon, Jul 23, 2018, 1:40 AM UTC

You could apply that knowledge as a business analyst, solutions architect, project manager, software developer in test (test automation)... There's definitely options, just depends on what fits for you.

Re: Ask HN: Got a CS degree, but I’m unable to be programmer. What can I do?

#35

Post by RickJWagner » Mon, Jul 23, 2018, 1:41 AM UTC

Become a writer, UX expert (hot ticket), tech writer, project manager, QE tech, etc.

Lots of other trails to take, maybe one of them will be a better fit. Good luck.

Re: Ask HN: Got a CS degree, but I’m unable to be programmer. What can I do?

#36

Post by denkmoon » Mon, Jul 23, 2018, 1:49 AM UTC

An undergraduate degree is an indication you can sit down and do complex work without needing someone holding your hand. It is not a life sentence to a particular career (that would be a PhD).

There are plenty of jobs you can do with a CS degree that don't involve being a programmer, as others have mentioned. Don't feel you need to work in that field either. A friend I did my BSc Biology with is now a financial advisor with one of the big four banks in Australia. Having any degree is good, having a STEM degree is even better.

Also, it sounds like a lot of this is in your head. You should talk about it to a close friend or someone you trust :)

Re: Ask HN: Got a CS degree, but I’m unable to be programmer. What can I do?

#37

Post by mikekij » Mon, Jul 23, 2018, 1:49 AM UTC

lastofus wrote: post #19

If you have passable people skills and enjoy a bit of travel, you may consider sales engineering. You basically handle all of the technical things that are over the heads of the normal sales team, both pre and post sales. This will often look like integration type work -- trying to figure out how to make your companies product work in the prospect/customer's environment.

This. I know a ton of sales engineers who love the combination of technical discussion (even if theoretical) and human interaction. And it tends to be a profitable career path too!

Re: Ask HN: Got a CS degree, but I’m unable to be programmer. What can I do?

#38

Post by LorenPechtel » Mon, Jul 23, 2018, 2:01 AM UTC

zunzun wrote: post #7

At work you will normally have an internet connection, so what are effectively useless "elite code" algorithm puzzles are A) easily looked up, and B) not most of what the work is. Those are not realistic problems, business have better things to do than waste time on those sort of things. Here is a realistic problem that might be encountered at work: "We need output X under these circumstances, but instead got output…

Estimate time to correct?? Most of the time that's very low, the hard part is figuring out why you get Y instead of X.

Re: Ask HN: Got a CS degree, but I’m unable to be programmer. What can I do?

#39

Post by jokh » Mon, Jul 23, 2018, 2:02 AM UTC

AnimalMuppet wrote: post #27

jokh wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is true, but in order to get the jobs you described that pay reasonably well you still need to solve algorithmic problems on Leetcode or CTCI. And sometimes knowing different data structures and algorithms do come in handy, so some problems on Leetcode can be considered realistic.

No, you can get there by finding jobs where the interviewers/hiring managers aren't using Leetcode as their filter. (They do exist, even if they're not as common as they should be.)

That's why I said "pay reasonably well". It seems to me that most places that don't interview and filter candidates by asking algorithmic problems don't pay as well as those that do. That's just been my experience as a student that's interviewed for internships and is going to start interviewing for new grad positions in the fall.

Also

> (They do exist, even if they're not as common as they should be.)

I'm curious why you think interviews _should_ be non-algorithmic. How do you propose interviews be done? How else are you supposed to find if someone can employ critical thinking + has the necessary programming skills? And yes, most interview questions _are_ original and not straight from Leetcode so they do demonstrate critical thinking + programming skills.

Re: Ask HN: Got a CS degree, but I’m unable to be programmer. What can I do?

#40

Post by mkozlows » Mon, Jul 23, 2018, 2:03 AM UTC

Don't get hung up on the problems. 98% of the people I've worked with couldn't, e.g., reverse a linked list to save their life. Many of them were perfectly fine professional programmers all the same.

If you have a CS degree, it is almost 100% certain that you are qualified to do programming at a bank or insurance company or whatever at the very least. If you're scared of the intimidating tech companies, then just skip them and go work somewhere that'll be less stressful.