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Ecuador will hand over Julian Assange to the UK

theintercept.com

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Re: Ecuador will hand over Julian Assange to the UK

#201

Post by bootlooped »

blhack wrote: post #9

What I've wanted for Julian Assange, Edward Snowden, and Chelsea Manning, and if Obama would have done it before leaving office, it would have earned him infinite respect: Try them, possibly even find them guilty of something, but also award them with the Presidential Medal of Freedom. What these people have done is probably illegal, but it is unquestionably about the most American, patriotic act you could commit. Sp…

Julian Assange does many things that seem to have the sole purpose of embarrassing the US. I don't see how he could be a candidate for any type of award from the US government. Any benefit Wikileaks has had on the US, primarily by helping spark a debate about domestic surveillance, is overshadowed by the harm they've done due to his radical anti-secrecy zealotry.

Take the Vault 7 releases for example. What was the public good done by that information being published? Those are our weapons, in my eyes it is not much different than if Wikileaks had published the blueprints for the F-35. There is a legitimate interest in the US having secrets, and there is an interest in our global adversaries not having them.

At least with the diplomatic cables and the DNC emails, there was some amount of public interest information in there, but why dump the whole set? To embarrass the US, and in the latter case, to affect the election. Are those noble goals worthy of the Presidential Medal of Freedom?

As for his personal character, recall two things: he screwed over his supporters by jumping bail in England, and he reneged on a pledged to acquiesce to extradition if Manning was released. These are not the actions of a hero to be celebrated, they're selfish and dishonorable.

Re: Ecuador will hand over Julian Assange to the UK

#202

Post by mancerayder »

scottmf wrote: post #99
res0nat0r wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If Assange is going to get anything from the USA is extradited to it and charged with trading in knowingly stolen material to undermine the candidate of the 2016 election he didn't like. Based on what was in the last Mueller indictment we'll see what happens between the US and the UK.

Yeah, Assange is no hero. His communications with Trump Jr and the leaked Wikileaks chats make that clear—as well as his meetings with people like Nigel Farage and Dana Rohrabacher. Assange has had a very clear agenda for some time now.

Assange has had a very clear agenda for some time now.

I thought his agenda was exposing privacy violations and the implications for authoritarian snooping without cause.

But it smells like you wanted to say something else and ran out of time while writing that comment?

Re: Ecuador will hand over Julian Assange to the UK

#203

Post by guitarbill »

nradov wrote: post #143
guitarbill wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Plus, the UN's Working Group on Arbitrary Detention has also found that he is in arbitrary detention... in 2016. The UK has conveniently ignored this breach of human rights. Whatever Assange did or didn't do, and whatever this media and political spectacle is, it isn't justice.

UN working groups have no legal authority.

Yes, apparently. And that somehow makes it okay to ignore?

Meanwhile, the UK continues the farce, costing a disproportionate amount of taxpayer money given the accusations.

Re: Ecuador will hand over Julian Assange to the UK

#204

Post by bootlooped »

lifeformed wrote: post #81
blhack wrote: post #9

What I've wanted for Julian Assange, Edward Snowden, and Chelsea Manning, and if Obama would have done it before leaving office, it would have earned him infinite respect: Try them, possibly even find them guilty of something, but also award them with the Presidential Medal of Freedom. What these people have done is probably illegal, but it is unquestionably about the most American, patriotic act you could commit. Sp…

How do you reconcile your view of Assange with these facts: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WikiLeaks#Allegations_of_Russi... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WikiLeaks#Correspondence_betwe... .

That second link appears to just go to the Wikileaks Wikipedia page now, the section may have been removed? This article covers the same content:

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/11/the-sec...

Re: Ecuador will hand over Julian Assange to the UK

#205

Post by s73v3r_ »

Pica_soO wrote: post #189
s73v3r_ wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're saying it was purely the sexual assault, and nothing to do with becoming a puppet of Putin?

If you drive somebody out into the cold and he starts to carve himself a igloo in the snowman, what was there first? The Traitors, who shoved a good man into a hostile environment or the bad deal of someone who refused to die for principals, neither of us would risk his neck for. If you are hunted and stateless, you are breathing thin air - and cant choosy with your allies. Ideals are not calories, ideals dont warm a…

Don’t care; he allied himself with Putin to spread disinformation. He tarnished his own reputation, and has no one but himself to blame.

Re: Ecuador will hand over Julian Assange to the UK

#206

Post by dingaling »

einarfd wrote: post #146
ddebernardy wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then again, to his credit, he eventually met his Swedish prosecutors from the safety of the embassy (and released the gory details a month later [1]). And there were genuine concerns from the get go that he'd get booted across the Atlantic had he stepped out of the embassy. I've honestly no idea how warranted the rape claims in Sweden were - and to be clear, I'd tend to side with the women who filed them - but you ca…

Sweden has a long history of being a neutral country, it spent the whole of the cold war as that, and is still not a member of NATO. They did departure that doctrine somewhat when they joined the European Union. But it is still very much alive. Extraditing Assange to the USA over a political charge would have been a huge departure of the neutrality doctrine, I have a hard time seeing how any Swedish government would…

Swedish Cold War neutrality was a sham. They aligned their tactics and weapons acquisitions with NATO standards. From the 1950s onwards they secretly collaborated with the UK and USA on intelligence and defensive plans.

There really was no question that they were in the NATO sphere except for formality.

Finland was more truly neutral.

Re: Ecuador will hand over Julian Assange to the UK

#207

Post by patient_zero »

slg wrote: post #192
patient_zero wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hey, now I've got downvotes too! My opinion is unpopular, and it was just questioning why other people downvoted you, so I retract my previous guess, as it was clearly wrong. It turns out people just don't like things they disagree with What can ya do? :) My comment mostly reflects how interesting I find it that people can justify anything they like based on their previous beliefs, cherry-picking facts that suit what…

I see what you are saying here, but I think that is a different argument than the one you made in the first comment. My question still remains, do people who view Assange positively not care about his involvement with Russia or do they think it is excusable because the ends justify the means? Whether Assange was a willing participant in that involvement would likely impact people's answers, but I don't think that unk…

ah, and here I'll apologize for my inability to properly express myself previously.

rather, i was trying to guess the motivations behind your downvoters, based on my own reasoning, a hazardous proposition at best. i meant to distance myself from any critique/judgement of your position but my own opinion was made clear, wasn't it? oops.

you've guessed it, i don't wish to discuss your question at all, no offense. i believe it's a distraction and of little importance. This belief, though i am confident it is a product of my incredible intellect¹, more likely comes mostly from my distaste the US government due to the things I've read in the leaks, and my belief that the US government would do anything to bury wikileaks, up to and including slander and libel.

¹clearly sarcasm, for those invisible down voters

Re: Ecuador will hand over Julian Assange to the UK

#208

Post by bootlooped »

ddebernardy wrote: post #113
einarfd wrote: post #97

To a lot of people Assange is a hero, and I'll grant that I liked a lot of the early actions of Wikileak under him. But to me, he is first and foremost someone that ran from a sexual assault investigation and has spent the years since that trying to evade justice. I have no regard left for the man after doing that. Some will argue that he would not have gotten a fair hearing in Sweden, and that they would have extrad…

Then again, to his credit, he eventually met his Swedish prosecutors from the safety of the embassy (and released the gory details a month later [1]). And there were genuine concerns from the get go that he'd get booted across the Atlantic had he stepped out of the embassy. I've honestly no idea how warranted the rape claims in Sweden were - and to be clear, I'd tend to side with the women who filed them - but you ca…

> Then again, to his credit, he eventually met his Swedish prosecutors from the safety of the embassy

I'm not sure he deserves credit for this. He met with them in an effort to appease them and hopefully get them to lay off. The risk of him meeting them in the embassy was low to none, right?

Re: Ecuador will hand over Julian Assange to the UK

#209

Post by lifeformed »

bootlooped wrote: post #204
lifeformed wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you reconcile your view of Assange with these facts: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WikiLeaks#Allegations_of_Russi... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WikiLeaks#Correspondence_betwe... .

That second link appears to just go to the Wikileaks Wikipedia page now, the section may have been removed? This article covers the same content: https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/11/the-sec...

Some reason the period at the end of the URL gets deleted when I try to post it. It's supposed to go to the section right above the first link.

Re: Ecuador will hand over Julian Assange to the UK

#210

Post by ryanlol »

carlosrg wrote: post #195
ryanlol wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What claims did Assange make in regards to the Catalonia situation?

Too many tweets to listen, but some of the most egregious claims he made: - Spain were going to physically invade Catalonia and cause a Tiananmen Square-like situation - The president of Spain wanted a "1000 year Reich" (ironic since that president was ousted by a no-confidence vote around a month ago. Guess the Reichs in Spain don't last long) - Spanish federal Police warned jihadist terrorists that Mossos were foll…

>- Spain were going to physically invade Catalonia and cause a Tiananmen Square-like situation

>The president of Spain wanted a "1000 year Reich"

>- Spanish federal Police warned jihadist terrorists that Mossos were following them (Catalonia police)

https://twitter.com/JulianAssange/status/910056476814794752

https://twitter.com/JulianAssange/status/917691333191585792

https://twitter.com/JulianAssange/status/931712044662792192

He's posting links, he's not the one making these claims. The jihadist story is straight from a Spanish newspaper.

>- And my "favorite" one, the one time when he said that there's 7.5 millions of Catalonians and if they were mobilized they could oust Spanish armed forces. So yes, basically asking for a civil war.

https://twitter.com/JulianAssange/status/914477133195616257

If this is the tweet you are referring to, I don't think that's a very honest description. He's clearly talking about their ability to keep polling stations running, and not calling for a civil war.

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