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Project Fuchsia: Google Is Quietly Working on a Successor to Android

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Re: Project Fuchsia: Google Is Quietly Working on a Successor to Android

#161

Post by senatorobama »

ashelmire wrote: post #113
_m96l wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Per the article, Google has over 100 engineers working on Fuchsia. If these are all "senior engineers" that "Google is trying to retain", the cost of keeping them must be at least 50 million per year. That's a lot of money to pay just for retention of people who are not producing anything of value, consuming many other resources (office space, network, hardware, perks), and deeply committed to a project that supposed…

> If these are all "senior engineers" that "Google is trying to retain", the cost of keeping them must be at least 50 million per year. Wait uh... are you saying seniors at Google make an average of $500k?

Must be the first law of HN: Every thread devolves into a discussion of $1mn+ engineer salaries ;)

Re: Project Fuchsia: Google Is Quietly Working on a Successor to Android

#162

Post by jmull »

It sounds very unlikely Fuchsia will replace Android or Chrome OS. They list a bunch of Android issues, but which of these can’t be addressed more incrementally through Android?

Google probably needs fewer OSs, not more.

The idea that this is a senior engineer retention project is what actually makes sense. I think it will probably yield some useful results that can be harvested for their other systems, or perhaps it can fill a niche not already well fillled.

Re: Project Fuchsia: Google Is Quietly Working on a Successor to Android

#163

Post by dlor »

ashelmire wrote: post #113
_m96l wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Per the article, Google has over 100 engineers working on Fuchsia. If these are all "senior engineers" that "Google is trying to retain", the cost of keeping them must be at least 50 million per year. That's a lot of money to pay just for retention of people who are not producing anything of value, consuming many other resources (office space, network, hardware, perks), and deeply committed to a project that supposed…

> If these are all "senior engineers" that "Google is trying to retain", the cost of keeping them must be at least 50 million per year. Wait uh... are you saying seniors at Google make an average of $500k?

Senior engineer can either mean "an engineer with a significant amount of experience" or "a title for a specific position at a specific company".

Either way based on my experience as a manager at Google, the answer to your question is yes.

Re: Project Fuchsia: Google Is Quietly Working on a Successor to Android

#164

Post by rlac16 »

robocat wrote: post #126

Surely Google are setting themselves up for another $5G EU antitrust fine? I thought one of the core reasons for the fine was the restriction in the Mobile Applications Distribution Agreement that a company couldn't develop a competing OS... Yet Google is? Alternatively they will use it as the core for a new "Nexus" line to compete with Apple, and not licence Fuscia as a platform (avoiding dominance of the mobile "Pl…

There was no absolute restriction on developing a competing OS (Samsung does it with Tizen for example). My understanding is that the restriction was on forking the Android codebase and shipping an OS based on that without the Play Store (you would then lose your Play Store license on all devices). Even then I'm not sure whether it's as strict as that, considering Xiaomi and others do it.

Re: Project Fuchsia: Google Is Quietly Working on a Successor to Android

#165

Post by RestlessMind »

Razengan wrote: post #125
RestlessMind wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The main reason why this won't work is that majority of public simply prefers free ad-infested services over paid ad-free ones. Case in point - YouTube Red and it's abysmal adoption rate. One might reasonable argue that YT Red just removes ads, but doesn't do anything for privacy / data collection. But I have two questions for them: 1. what makes you think people would gladly pay for privacy (any glaring example)? ,…

> The main reason why this won't work is that majority of public simply prefers free ad-infested services over paid ad-free ones. Counterpoint: Apple, one of the most profitable companies. People have been giving their money to Apple before they even flaunted a strong pro-privacy stance, and I have yet to see an ad from Apple that I did not opt in for (although their recent Apple Pay emails have been slightly annoyin…

Hence the phrase: "majority of public"

Rich people with lots of disposable income would, not surprisingly, prefer quality for a higher price. But that is not the business model of Google, nor is it applicable for everyone.

Re: Project Fuchsia: Google Is Quietly Working on a Successor to Android

#166

Post by puzzle »

nostrademons wrote: post #127
dunpeal wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> $50M is tiny compared to the opportunity cost of having 100 of your best engineers jump ship to a competitor or found a new one. See my comment to nnq. You can't just take "100 of your best engineers", and stick them on some bogus project that regularly gets raided for its best talent by hiring managers. If they'd rather work on a bogus project than on a real product, they're not very useful engineers. The project…

> Have you worked for a FAANG? I was at Google for 5.5 years and was the beneficiary of an engineer-retention project for a year of that. I'm now working on a startup. Think of it from the company's perspective: they have an engineer who has already been "paid off" in the sense of having generated more revenue for the company than they are likely to get in salary during a lifetime, and is likely independently wealthy…

There's more: Cos and the open source Vanadium, John Hanke and Ingress/FieldTrip, Niniane and Lively, Hartmut and the quantum lab, Craig N-M and google.org, etc.

But you left out the largest retention side project: Jeff Dean and Brain.

Re: Project Fuchsia: Google Is Quietly Working on a Successor to Android

#167

Post by jtmcmc »

puzzle wrote: post #166
nostrademons wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Have you worked for a FAANG? I was at Google for 5.5 years and was the beneficiary of an engineer-retention project for a year of that. I'm now working on a startup. Think of it from the company's perspective: they have an engineer who has already been "paid off" in the sense of having generated more revenue for the company than they are likely to get in salary during a lifetime, and is likely independently wealthy…

There's more: Cos and the open source Vanadium, John Hanke and Ingress/FieldTrip, Niniane and Lively, Hartmut and the quantum lab, Craig N-M and google.org, etc. But you left out the largest retention side project: Jeff Dean and Brain.

also sebastian thrun and google[x] / self driving cars

Re: Project Fuchsia: Google Is Quietly Working on a Successor to Android

#168

Post by jonny_eh »

myth_drannon wrote: post #84
losvedir wrote: post #11

I wrote a small Flutter app recently and rather enjoyed the experience. I'm reluctant to spend more time on the technology, though, since it seems like it has a high chance of dying out. But as I understand it, Fuchsia would have native apps written using Flutter as well, which would be great, so I really hope it does take off.

Why do you think it has a high chance of dying?

It's based on Dart, a language that already failed to take off in browsers? Just a guess.

Re: Project Fuchsia: Google Is Quietly Working on a Successor to Android

#169

Post by ashleyn »

remir wrote: post #60

"One person who has spoken to Fuchsia staff described the effort simply: "It’s a senior-engineer retention project." This has been my therory for a while. You see all these different projects competing against each other (multiple messaging apps are a good example) and you think: why is Google so unfocused? But what Google basically wants to do is hoard engineers so they don't leave and go work for competitors and ma…

HP, Xerox, and AT&T figured that out decades ago.

Re: Project Fuchsia: Google Is Quietly Working on a Successor to Android

#170

Post by oscargrouch »

_m96l wrote: post #86
remir wrote: post #60

"One person who has spoken to Fuchsia staff described the effort simply: "It’s a senior-engineer retention project." This has been my therory for a while. You see all these different projects competing against each other (multiple messaging apps are a good example) and you think: why is Google so unfocused? But what Google basically wants to do is hoard engineers so they don't leave and go work for competitors and ma…

Per the article, Google has over 100 engineers working on Fuchsia. If these are all "senior engineers" that "Google is trying to retain", the cost of keeping them must be at least 50 million per year. That's a lot of money to pay just for retention of people who are not producing anything of value, consuming many other resources (office space, network, hardware, perks), and deeply committed to a project that supposed…

> That's a lot of money to pay just for retention of people who are not producing anything of value, consuming many other resources (office space, network, hardware, perks), and deeply committed to a project that supposedly will never benefit their employer.

I think Google figure it out its real bussiness like MacDonalds did: Not burgers, but real state bussiness. I think Google understood they are not in the make "valuable useful tech" bussiness as one is inclined to think, they are in the "tech talent retention bussiness".

Even if they dont use the talent, if they are able to lock the talent inside Google as a kid in a Circus, their competitors wont have access to the talent pool they need, and this will make a big monopoly on Google.

Of course, this is only possible if you have the ammount of cash and credentials Google have to attract tech people like Disney do to kids.

I think this is their real primary mission; attract human talent, retain and ultimately lock it from the competition.

Do you ever wonder why the startup scene is so dry lately, even with so many enginners and tech focused people no short of ideas? The titans are just sucking all the oxigene in the room making everyone else choke.

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