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I’m leaving China

baldingsworld.com

121–130 of 219 posts

Re: I’m leaving China

#121
Even so [the western missionary] was stunned at how deeply and rigidly held the belief that making money was the entire meaning of life. There was no value system.

Consider also how the national psyche and personal outlooks on the world have been impacted by a lifetime of propaganda celebrating Han-centric nationalism, expansionist foreign policy, and a self-appointed party leadership whose control and policies can never be seriously questioned.

Re: I’m leaving China

#122
post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's true, but not in the 20th century. For lots of reasons, China broadly missed the industrial revolution. By the time of the communist revolution, they had... basically nothing indigenous. There was no export industry, most people were at a subsistence level, and essentially the entirety of the social elite were foreign-educated aristocracy simply living off of assets worked by a staggeringly large underclass. I…

> And now their grandkids are almost as rich as Americans. False. US: mean wealth $388,000. medium wealth $55,000. gdp per capita: $60000. China: mean wealth $26,000. medium wealth $6,000. gdp per capita: $8000. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_wealth_pe...

Sigh. It was hyperbole. You took, the point, right? They were the poorest of the poor, and now their iPhones jiggle in their pockets as they dance on the world stage with the big kids.

Also, "median".

Re: I’m leaving China

#123
post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This isn’t true: at various periods during world history, China has been one of the richest and educated countries in the world. The potential of its people was already there and all that was needed was a peaceful environment with an enabling government.

That's true, but not in the 20th century. For lots of reasons, China broadly missed the industrial revolution. By the time of the communist revolution, they had... basically nothing indigenous. There was no export industry, most people were at a subsistence level, and essentially the entirety of the social elite were foreign-educated aristocracy simply living off of assets worked by a staggeringly large underclass. I…

China missed the industrial revolution, but didn’t lose 5000 years of development in the process. Look st how fast Germany and Japan bounced back from being bombed into oblivion? Once development is in your DNA, recovery is much easier, it’s not like starting from a mostly undeveloped country in SE Asia or Africa.

Re: I’m leaving China

#124
post #22

Can anyone comment on the risks of posting such an essay while still living in China? Is this considered safely within the lines, a calculated risk, or something else? (Or has he already left China before posting the essay?)

One data point: it was an explicitly stated rule of my Chinese student visa that I don't publicise any criticism of China.

Re: I’m leaving China

#125
>There is a complete and utter lack of respect for the individual or person in China. People do not have innate value as people simply because they exist.

Respect for the individual simply because they exist as opposed to being part of a larger group is mostly a recent West cultural thing. In most places, and throughout most of human history, what has given a person value is their relationship to the larger society.

Re: I’m leaving China

#126

Being in other countries like China and France really makes me appreciate how world class the customer service is in America. Here in the US, you can tell a waiter that your not happy with a dish and they'll immediately replace it with whatever you want. You can make substitutions, you can alter the way it's cooked (within reason), etc, and they still greet you with a smile and deliver excellent service. There are ma…

American wait staff have to rely on tips rather than a living wage, which forces them to take unending amounts of crap, or else they can't pay the rent. American consumers can and do verbally (and sometimes physically) abuse wait staff, and if the staff don't sit there and take it with a smile, they get fired. I don't find this an endearing trait.

Being able to send a dish back doesn't exist because waiters rely on tips. If restaurant owners and managers didn't accept it, waiters would not be permitted to do it. It's not like waiters take a plate back to the line and beg the cooks to do another one because otherwise they won't get tipped. "The customer is always right" is why American service (in general, not just in restaurants) is customer-friendly. It has nothing to do with tipping waitstaff.

Re: I’m leaving China

#127
post #101

Being in other countries like China and France really makes me appreciate how world class the customer service is in America. Here in the US, you can tell a waiter that your not happy with a dish and they'll immediately replace it with whatever you want. You can make substitutions, you can alter the way it's cooked (within reason), etc, and they still greet you with a smile and deliver excellent service. There are ma…

> Being in other countries like China and France really makes me appreciate how world class the customer service is in America. I can't speak about China, but I'm going to call you out on France as a counterexample. I have had very good service every time I have been to France. I speak a very little French, and executed most things in English and people were as friendly and helpful as they were anywhere in the US. I…

NYC people are more blunt than rude, in my experience (Californian who's spent a couple years there). There's a fun little cartoon book that gets into the logic of this: https://www.amazon.com/Basic-Tips-Etiquette-Nathan-Pyle/dp/0...

Re: I’m leaving China

#128

The issues the author has about line cutting and openly gawking seemed kinda interesting. In my view line cutting happens because people have this view that their time is more valuable than anyone else's, and so they don't see it as breaking any 'rules' as such. And this isn't unique to China, you can see this in a lot of poorer south/south-east Asian countries. Kinda why driving is also a nightmare in these countrie…

I grew up in China. Line cutting has always been annoying, even infuriating, for me. The last few times I visited back, I noticed the young generations are much better in this aspect. There are rarely any improvements in this regard among my generation and older ones. So I guess we have to wait for nature taking its time.

Gawking is common in places that are not culturally diverse. I drove to many small towns in Midwest. I got stared at when I was walking around the town. Especially so when I entered local stores, diners, and pubs where everybody else was white. I could tell many store owners, waitresses, etc. were not comfortable when talking to me. I hope it is getting better.

Re: I’m leaving China

#129
post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And now their grandkids are almost as rich as Americans. False. US: mean wealth $388,000. medium wealth $55,000. gdp per capita: $60000. China: mean wealth $26,000. medium wealth $6,000. gdp per capita: $8000. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_wealth_pe...

Sigh. It was hyperbole. You took, the point, right? They were the poorest of the poor, and now their iPhones jiggle in their pockets as they dance on the world stage with the big kids. Also, "median".

Half their population, 700M people, can't afford the iphone.

The annual income for rural residents averaged $1,797 last year

https://www.scmp.com/news/china/society/article/2089654/chin...

Re: I’m leaving China

#130

Being in other countries like China and France really makes me appreciate how world class the customer service is in America. Here in the US, you can tell a waiter that your not happy with a dish and they'll immediately replace it with whatever you want. You can make substitutions, you can alter the way it's cooked (within reason), etc, and they still greet you with a smile and deliver excellent service. There are ma…

American service must be that way because the variance in the behavior of the customers is so wide.

How many French customers ask for gluten free water with a straight face?

How many French customers request a cube of ice to plunk in their merlot?

How many French kitchens stockpile frozen nugget-shaped food items because families expect them to tailor to the needs of their screaming toddlers?

An American server will effortlessly deal with all three while politely denying entry to the woman who is yelling about the constitutional rights of her emotional support goat.

If American economy is slowly becoming Arrakis from Dune, our wait staff is the Fremen.

The people who can destroy a thing, they control it.

So tip them well.

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