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Goodbye Microservices: From 100s of problem children to 1 superstar

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Re: Goodbye Microservices: From 100s of problem children to 1 superstar

#561

Post by scrollaway »

staticassertion wrote: post #557
weberc2 wrote: post #550

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> no, it is still not an easy choice Yeah it is, choose 3. Python 2 is reaching EOL. > Mypy coverage, even in the stdlib, is awful. When it comes to thirdparty, mostly nonexistent. Mypy feels so young - I love the team, love their work, but I still run into cases where inference fails when it shouldn't, where error messages are extremely helpful, etc. Yeah, the typing stuff is a pretty big disappointment. The ergonom…

> Yeah it is, choose 3. Python 2 is reaching EOL. Easy to say. Tell that to Google and Dropbox - Guido has worked for both and they're on 2. Tell that to the companies that can't afford the creator of the language. 3 is not the easy choice. Anyways, maybe try nim? I've heard good things.

"2 or 3" wasn't a choice for Dropbox/Google, and even if it had been, it's not a choice that concerns you. All the stuff they produce publicly is Python 3-compatible.

Re: Goodbye Microservices: From 100s of problem children to 1 superstar

#562

Post by voltagex_ »

maxxxxx wrote: post #559
User23 wrote: post #551

Earlier quoted context omitted.

COM wasn't a picnic to work with back when it was the new thing. The toolchain sucked. I'll never write another line of MIDL in my life.

Agreed. Although with tools like Visual Basic it was quite nice to use. Now, DCOM was another story. Pretty much everybody I knew who used it started to become suicidal after a while...

I still maintain a (third party) app that requires DCOM.

Re: Goodbye Microservices: From 100s of problem children to 1 superstar

#563

Post by fbonetti »

s73v3r_ wrote: post #438
myth_drannon wrote: post #430

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Resume driven development. I've worked for a similar small company with barely any users/data but the tech choices were driven by how useful is the tech for their future job prospects and not the current or future needs of an organization.

Maybe if companies gave sufficient raises and promotions, and actually tried to retain talent, then we wouldn't have this culture where people keep having to switch jobs, and therefore always be looking out for what will get them the next gig.

I think engineers would still jump ship just as often even if they were paid more. When you really get down to it, most programming is pretty tedious. What makes it fun, for some engineers, is the opportunity to learn new things, even it means doing so at the detriment of the business.

Re: Goodbye Microservices: From 100s of problem children to 1 superstar

#564

Post by [deleted] »

User23 wrote: post #554
crimsonalucard wrote: post #514

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The practices of Doctors are based off of science and theory. Design patterns and microservices while technical are not based off of science. They are ideas without quantitiative basis or science.

Actually computing science is the most well understood science. Physicists can only give results with a few millionths* of accuracy, a computing scientist can prove a theorem about his subject matter with perfect accuracy. Everyone else, including doctors, who call themselves scientists are just trying to float on the cachet physicists earned with their astonishingly good predictions. Properly speaking, they are phen…

[deleted]

Re: Goodbye Microservices: From 100s of problem children to 1 superstar

#565

Post by chrisco255 »

nevir wrote: post #304
chrisco255 wrote: post #275

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's nothing declarative about HTML except for its extremely limited use case of rendering text.

HTML is purely declarative. Each HTML document describes what it wants to have rendered, but does not describe how it should be rendered.

Yeah, div soup is so declarative. All I need to do is look at the HTML to understand how my app behaves...oh wait, no I need to reference a CSS class and iterate over 15 cascading rules and then I need to fetch whatever JS is referencing that div to understand how it's being rendered to the page. So declarative.

Re: Goodbye Microservices: From 100s of problem children to 1 superstar

#566

Post by staticassertion »

scrollaway wrote: post #561
staticassertion wrote: post #557

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Yeah it is, choose 3. Python 2 is reaching EOL. Easy to say. Tell that to Google and Dropbox - Guido has worked for both and they're on 2. Tell that to the companies that can't afford the creator of the language. 3 is not the easy choice. Anyways, maybe try nim? I've heard good things.

"2 or 3" wasn't a choice for Dropbox/Google, and even if it had been, it's not a choice that concerns you. All the stuff they produce publicly is Python 3-compatible.

My point is that tons and tons of companies, with many billions of lines of code, do not have an easy option.

Plenty of the environment still has not moved over even outside of companies.

Re: Goodbye Microservices: From 100s of problem children to 1 superstar

#567

Post by chrisco255 »

timr wrote: post #409
chrisco255 wrote: post #274

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ha, JQuery. I just had to look at a legacy JQuery code base...and I shudder the thought of ever going back to that paradigm. Sometimes new patterns/frameworks/architectures do really change the game for good.

I still use jQuery regularly. It works well and doesn't get in the way. I'd rather work on a jQuery codebase written by a good engineer than a React codebase written by an average engineer, and there's no amount you could pay me to work on a Javascript codebase written by a bad engineer. The problem you've identified is that most code, in general, is terrible. The code written by people who chase trends tends to be w…

I wouldn't. React makes it hard to FUBAR a front end. JQuery makes it stupidly easy to write a spaghetti code unmaintainable mess.

Re: Goodbye Microservices: From 100s of problem children to 1 superstar

#568

Post by crimsonalucard »

User23 wrote: post #554
crimsonalucard wrote: post #514

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The practices of Doctors are based off of science and theory. Design patterns and microservices while technical are not based off of science. They are ideas without quantitiative basis or science.

Actually computing science is the most well understood science. Physicists can only give results with a few millionths* of accuracy, a computing scientist can prove a theorem about his subject matter with perfect accuracy. Everyone else, including doctors, who call themselves scientists are just trying to float on the cachet physicists earned with their astonishingly good predictions. Properly speaking, they are phen…

You are diving to deep and talking about the difference between formal logic and empirical sciences. I am not talking about that.

Things like algorithmic complexity are well understood and formalized but design patterns are not a science nor has the concepts ever been formalized..

There is no theory or formalized system that says monolithic is better than micro or vice versa, it's all opinion. That's why its' called design.

Re: Goodbye Microservices: From 100s of problem children to 1 superstar

#569

Post by crimsonalucard »

agentultra wrote: post #542
crimsonalucard wrote: post #514

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The practices of Doctors are based off of science and theory. Design patterns and microservices while technical are not based off of science. They are ideas without quantitiative basis or science.

Model checking is based off of mathematics and can be verified or, with some elbow grease, proven . I'll take a TLA+ specification over a diagram any day.

What do you mean by model checking? Usually anything with the keyword "Design" like design patterns for microservices have no science or mathematics to back it up.

Re: Goodbye Microservices: From 100s of problem children to 1 superstar

#570

Post by crimsonalucard »

jonny_eh wrote: post #340
crimsonalucard wrote: post #327

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's really more math then anything. Building concepts from atomic axioms.

I like to think of it as dynamic math. Calculus is also a form of "math over time", but is more about a single equation to describe that change over time. Computer science is more like "math with discrete logical steps over time". It allows you to answer questions like "which algorithm can sort a given array in the fewest steps"?

Math is building formal logic systems based off of a set of a few axioms. Computer science is essentially an aspect of this.
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