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Chrome developer tools to master

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Re: Chrome developer tools to master

#31

Post by 0xfeba »

judofyr wrote: post #25
wild_preference wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

None of those apply to their fizzbuzz-level question. I’m guessing you don’t have much experience with front-end code if you think this is Chrome tooling specific. It’s really the equivalent of reading a stack trace to get an idea of where to look instead of wolf-fencing off the bat with println. “I would’ve read the stack trace if I knew you wanted me to!” wouldn’t be a good defense, likewise. Yes, you can teach som…

> I’m guessing you don’t have much experience with front-end code Okay. You're guessing wrong. I'm just asking for a bit honesty here. If they start adding console.log everywhere, how about you ask them why they're doing it that way? In a codebase I know nothing about it's not uncommon for me to add some console.log around to see how the code flows. Adding breakpoints isn't efficient when it's being hit 100 of times;…

I don't hold off important info. I mean, I won't give the answer but I encourage dialog.

And your console.log example is valid, but this isn't the same situation. It's a button press, the fetch call is made.

I tell them what it should do, I say I would use the debugger but ask them what they would do.

Re: Chrome developer tools to master

#32

Post by [deleted] »

0xfeba wrote: post #3

I implemented two simple interview tests in order to weed out people who can't do simple debugging. In one, I hand them my laptop and give them a basic create-react-app sample that uses fetch on a remote URL, but there's a typo in the URL. I tell them it's supposed to fetch a remote REST API and parse the JSON but it doesn't work--how would you fix it? So far, two ways to pass: Just look at the source code, or use th…

[deleted]

Re: Chrome developer tools to master

#33

Post by 0xfeba »

fermuch wrote: post #13
0xfeba wrote: post #3

I implemented two simple interview tests in order to weed out people who can't do simple debugging. In one, I hand them my laptop and give them a basic create-react-app sample that uses fetch on a remote URL, but there's a typo in the URL. I tell them it's supposed to fetch a remote REST API and parse the JSON but it doesn't work--how would you fix it? So far, two ways to pass: Just look at the source code, or use th…

And what is the the second test?

Not so much debugging. Same create-react-app setup, but increment a counter on a button press. The solution is to add an event handler (which requires binding or an arrow function for the right context), and increment a state variable.

That and the debugging example are surprisingly effective at weeding out people who have "React" sprayed all over their resume but can't do one of the most common things.

We had one person who apparently had no fear of "3-1 pair programming with strangers" and instantly came up with the solution. She ended up taking a better offer though. Can't blame her. I wouldn't do as well as she did, and I wrote the damned thing.

Re: Chrome developer tools to master

#34

Post by [deleted] »

judofyr wrote: post #17
barbegal wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But if they don't know how to use the Chrome debugger then that probably correlates to not being able to do many other tasks. That few hours just teaching them how to use Chrome debugger turns into weeks of teaching them how to do lots of tasks. I have nothing against teaching new hires but for some businesses it is a significant cost so it makes sense to weed out applicants that won't be able to get stuck in straigh…

I see that knowledge about Chrome debugger probably correlates with knowledge about other tasks, but there has to be some false negatives, no? And mostly I find it a bit dishonest. If you have a preferred way to solve a problem in a company you should state it up-front: "Find this bug by using the debugger, not console.log, because that's the way we do it here". If the method does not matter, you should let they solv…

[deleted]

Re: Chrome developer tools to master

#35

Post by codezero »

slig wrote: post #9
codezero wrote: post #7

This is great, besides the Sources tab, I use DOM and Event breakpoints a ton to debug a lot of problems. Something, I'm not sure if most people know, if you break somewhere (whether event or DOM), you can access the currently in scope variables directly in the console. It's extremely useful for finding out what's going on with something in the middle of hairy code at a specific point in time.

It's also possible to change the value of these variables and test different code paths.

You're right! I was going to say that, but I didn't remember off the top of my head if that was true :)

Re: Chrome developer tools to master

#36

Post by adrianhel »

0xfeba wrote: post #3

I implemented two simple interview tests in order to weed out people who can't do simple debugging. In one, I hand them my laptop and give them a basic create-react-app sample that uses fetch on a remote URL, but there's a typo in the URL. I tell them it's supposed to fetch a remote REST API and parse the JSON but it doesn't work--how would you fix it? So far, two ways to pass: Just look at the source code, or use th…

I would be alarmed if the person was an > medium level dev and did nor know what was up within 30s. For entry level, it's not as easy. If a person did not find out within 45m, I probably wouldn't hire them.

Re: Chrome developer tools to master

#37

Post by judofyr »

0xfeba wrote: post #30
judofyr wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can’t you just ask them if they have experience with the Chrome debugger? And if that’s such a deal breaker for you, you can teach them in the first week? I mean, it’s not like the Chrome debugger is such a complicated beast. Even if you have no experience with it, you can probably learn 90% of the useful tricks in a few hours.

I do. I just verify. They can also use Firefox or any other browser's tools if they are more comfortable. We are not hiring junior devs, and even if so I would still probably ask. But experienced front end devs should know how to use a browser's debugger. Like others said, it's a flag that they potentially don't have problem solving skills. I mean, if they put a single console.log near what they think is going wrong…

Ah, that's good to hear. Sorry for the rant, and for interpreting you in the most negative way. As I've mentioned downthread, I've just annoyed with silly, definite, interviewing questions that's more like a trap and less like a discussion.

Re: Chrome developer tools to master

#38

Post by KevanM »

0xfeba wrote: post #30
judofyr wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can’t you just ask them if they have experience with the Chrome debugger? And if that’s such a deal breaker for you, you can teach them in the first week? I mean, it’s not like the Chrome debugger is such a complicated beast. Even if you have no experience with it, you can probably learn 90% of the useful tricks in a few hours.

I do. I just verify. They can also use Firefox or any other browser's tools if they are more comfortable. We are not hiring junior devs, and even if so I would still probably ask. But experienced front end devs should know how to use a browser's debugger. Like others said, it's a flag that they potentially don't have problem solving skills. I mean, if they put a single console.log near what they think is going wrong…

What's up with Console.log?

Re: Chrome developer tools to master

#39

Post by adrianhel »

Give the developer a simple task that is work relevant and 24h.

If the person does it in 5m using some fancy trick, then you know they're a problem solver of high calibre. 1h-5h: They are probably adequate. 24h: junior or bad.

Ask them about the trad offs they made. The 24h guy may not have made any, and may be the perfect maintainer. The 5m guy must have made some. Ask for their reasoning.

It may be the reason to hire them. It may be the reason not to.

Feel free to pay people for being tested.

Re: Chrome developer tools to master

#40

Post by kclay »

Can someone explain why the chrome browser simulator is so bad. I recently had to do some web work, normally don't deal with HTML . Anyways I tried to use the emulate view to test against iOS devices. Had QA test on a real device and it was all wrong. Ended up just getting a virtualbox of osx up to run the stimulator.

Normally it isn't a problem using it but trying to line up slanted designs with pixel perfect placement wasnt working out at all.

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