Big Tech’s Hot New Talent Incubator: Community College • Hacker News Board

Re: Big Tech’s Hot New Talent Incubator: Community College

#21

Post by barry-cotter » Sat, Jul 07, 2018, 5:22 PM UTC

jgh wrote: post #12

finaliteration wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the other advantage is that at most community colleges you are required to branch out from technical topics and take at least a few humanities and liberal arts courses. You end up coming out slightly more well-rounded which can be hugely beneficial both career and life wise.

you're not required to do humanities/liberal arts at US universities?

Outside the USA and its cultural appendages, Canada, South Korea and the like, it is assumed that anyone who goes to university has studied the liberal arts at secondary/high school. Given the low quality of secondary education in the US in the formative period of its third level system this could not be assumed so what would in Europe be considered (grammar school) high school classes and subjects are taught at university.

Re: Big Tech’s Hot New Talent Incubator: Community College

#22

Post by pjmorris » Sat, Jul 07, 2018, 5:23 PM UTC

ourmandave wrote: post #19

Back in the mid-80's my local CCs were teaching COBOL, JCL and Fortran. Probably because of that mainframe they had chilling in the server room. Personal computer courses were non-existent, except for one day "How To Use Your PC or Apple" class.

My first CC programming course (early 80's) was in Fortran (probably because of that mainframe they had chilling in the server room,) but I had several others on micros (TRS-80!) I have found being exposed to multiple environments helpful in the time since then.

Re: Big Tech’s Hot New Talent Incubator: Community College

#23

Post by grandmczeb » Sat, Jul 07, 2018, 5:24 PM UTC

barry-cotter wrote: post #17

chrisseaton wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't you need about 20 years of top tier papers to get to the rank of professor?

No, it’s just a title. Directional State University will have professors because they have a status hierarchy and titles are a significant part of that, and the total compensation. As I understand the US system for four year universities TOP Professor with an endowed chair University or Full Professor Associate Professor (They have tenure and time in position) Assistant Professor (They don’t have tenure. This is thei…

Your characterization of adjuncts is unnecessarily harsh. Many simply enjoy teaching in a university environment and aren't "desperately clinging" to anything.

Re: Big Tech’s Hot New Talent Incubator: Community College

#24

Post by mixmastamyk » Sat, Jul 07, 2018, 5:25 PM UTC

freehunter wrote: post #11

finaliteration wrote: post #2

I attended community college for a few years before transferring to a 4-year university. During that time I took a variety of technical and non-technical courses that I really enjoyed and felt I got a lot of value from due to the small class sizes and ability to connect with professors outside of class fairly easily. I would have stopped after getting my Associate’s degree as I felt like I had learned a lot and I had…

Community colleges really are underrated. In a world where increasingly a bachelor's degree does not guarantee a job, university education is super expensive, and especially in fields where a bachelor's degree is not necessary (I've never had an interview where they asked about my college education), vocational schools are the place to be. Four-year universities put big emphasis on well-rounded educations, so you're…

> (I've never had an interview where they asked about my college education.

They don’t ask, but many places throw your resume without a bachelors into the trash at the first step in the hiring process. Ask me how I know.

Re: Big Tech’s Hot New Talent Incubator: Community College

#25

Post by andernash » Sat, Jul 07, 2018, 5:26 PM UTC

disqard wrote: post #18

mettamage wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It really depends on the prequisite knowledge that you have. If you're good in reading knitting patterns, it means you have a tack for algorithms. If you know propositional logic because you were a philosophy major, then if-statements are basically a syntactic difference and nothing else. When I was a bootcamp instructor I noticed that my top students were able to pick up React Native or Electron without me teaching…

As someone with experience teaching younger people (middle school students) programming, I have also seen this three-way split, though it may not be an even one. 1. Learners who will succeed, regardless of the amount and nature of instruction. 2. Learners who will not be able to grasp the material, due to lack of engagement, interest, self-efficacy, or some other related factors that cannot easily be fixed in a one-t…

As an enterprise boot camp instructor who taught the same fullstack web dev curriculum to career desktop application engineers at a big company, I saw this three-way split as well.

Re: Big Tech’s Hot New Talent Incubator: Community College

#26

Post by iamdave » Sat, Jul 07, 2018, 5:34 PM UTC

montrose wrote: post #20

If this trend is real it will be really good for social mobility.

I'm having a similar though tangential reaction: is this trend saying something about the four year degree against changing demands for talent? I don't know but if I've long argued that if the Associates degree in the US was valued as something more than just "doorway to a BA/BS", the talent "shortage" (sarcastic quotes intentional) would probably disappear overnight.

Re: Big Tech’s Hot New Talent Incubator: Community College

#27

Post by toomuchtodo » Sat, Jul 07, 2018, 5:35 PM UTC

mixmastamyk wrote: post #24

freehunter wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Community colleges really are underrated. In a world where increasingly a bachelor's degree does not guarantee a job, university education is super expensive, and especially in fields where a bachelor's degree is not necessary (I've never had an interview where they asked about my college education), vocational schools are the place to be. Four-year universities put big emphasis on well-rounded educations, so you're…

> (I've never had an interview where they asked about my college education. They don’t ask, but many places throw your resume without a bachelors into the trash at the first step in the hiring process. Ask me how I know.

> They don’t ask, but many places throw your resume without a bachelors into the trash at the first step in the hiring process. Ask me how I know.

I'm very understanding of this sentiment. I have suggested to people to get around this by simply lying about having a bachelors degree on their resume. If the employer verifies, you're out nothing. If they don't, you have a job you otherwise wouldn't have had. You have to be able to do the job though.

Re: Big Tech’s Hot New Talent Incubator: Community College

#28

Post by barry-cotter » Sat, Jul 07, 2018, 5:40 PM UTC

grandmczeb wrote: post #23

barry-cotter wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, it’s just a title. Directional State University will have professors because they have a status hierarchy and titles are a significant part of that, and the total compensation. As I understand the US system for four year universities TOP Professor with an endowed chair University or Full Professor Associate Professor (They have tenure and time in position) Assistant Professor (They don’t have tenure. This is thei…

Your characterization of adjuncts is unnecessarily harsh. Many simply enjoy teaching in a university environment and aren't "desperately clinging" to anything.

Adjunct lecturing has terrible working conditions and benefits. It is a hobby, not a job. No one should do it as a job. Anyone who treats it as a job should be dissuaded from doing so as forcefully as possible to prevent further suffering. If you have a spouse with a good job and insurance or a trust fund by all means do it as a hobby, even an especially engrossing one.

Anyone who describes themself as an adjunct professor as if it’s sonetbing other than a hobby should be encouraged to get a job that isn’t shit. Teaching high school is vastly less intellectually rewarding but the holidays are better and so is the insurance and the pension.

Re: Big Tech’s Hot New Talent Incubator: Community College

#29

Post by Spooky23 » Sat, Jul 07, 2018, 5:43 PM UTC

chrisseaton wrote: post #8

finaliteration wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I did have a few professors among the normal “instructors” you typically find at community colleges. For example, one of my music professors had a Ph.D. and did transcription work that the college used.

Don't you need about 20 years of top tier papers to get to the rank of professor?

To reach the top rank yes... but academia is changing. Most professors now are contract, non-tenure track employees, especially in humanities.

Re: Big Tech’s Hot New Talent Incubator: Community College

#30

Post by munin » Sat, Jul 07, 2018, 5:44 PM UTC

barry-cotter wrote: post #28

grandmczeb wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your characterization of adjuncts is unnecessarily harsh. Many simply enjoy teaching in a university environment and aren't "desperately clinging" to anything.

Adjunct lecturing has terrible working conditions and benefits. It is a hobby, not a job. No one should do it as a job. Anyone who treats it as a job should be dissuaded from doing so as forcefully as possible to prevent further suffering. If you have a spouse with a good job and insurance or a trust fund by all means do it as a hobby, even an especially engrossing one. Anyone who describes themself as an adjunct pro…

> Teaching high school

I looked into this in my state. Getting your foot in the door as a teacher in a public school would require someone with a PhD in say, mathematics, physics or computer science, to go back to grad school for a masters in education. Not sure that's an option, and is also ridiculous considering I just spent six years in grad school. You could do TFA as a backdoor, in many states, but that is probably an even worse deal for you physically and emotionally than being an adjunct.