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California law requires businesses to let you cancel your subscription online

niemanlab.org

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Re: California law requires businesses to let you cancel your subscription online

#391
post #97

Are you actually deaf? Or is lying to get exceptions that are meant for the disabled actually legal?

I always check HN when I want a snitch's perspective.

Would you please stop posting unsubstantive comments to Hacker News? You've done it a ton, and we ban accounts that do this repeatedly.

Re: California law requires businesses to let you cancel your subscription online

#392

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Huh? Does your card number not change when you get a new one in the US?

Unless you specifically ask for a new number, not at all. What's even worse it that the cvv is changing (checksum with the date and card number) but the transaction can go thru without cvv submission in most cases.

what's the point of a cvv then? This seems rather odd

Re: California law requires businesses to let you cancel your subscription online

#393

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fucking assholes. I guess that's why we need these stupid laws.

I'm a libertarian and I don't know what to say. There will be shitty companies as well I guess, but when they lose customers due to such practices, they will learn? If they don't learn they will go out of business. You're stuck with a bad govt law, no efficient weeding out process exists.

That only works if they let you cancel. Otherwise they can't lose customers.

Re: California law requires businesses to let you cancel your subscription online

#394

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unless you specifically ask for a new number, not at all. What's even worse it that the cvv is changing (checksum with the date and card number) but the transaction can go thru without cvv submission in most cases.

what's the point of a cvv then? This seems rather odd

It's up to the merchant; since in the event of fraud they'll be the ones who get hit with the chargeback, it's up to them to decide if they want to require that extra safety or not.

Re: California law requires businesses to let you cancel your subscription online

#395

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fucking assholes. I guess that's why we need these stupid laws.

I'm a libertarian and I don't know what to say. There will be shitty companies as well I guess, but when they lose customers due to such practices, they will learn? If they don't learn they will go out of business. You're stuck with a bad govt law, no efficient weeding out process exists.

The thing about the invisible hand is that it works really well if you buy a chocolate bar that you don't like. The next day, you won't buy that same chocolate bar. However, when a handsome man in a suit offers my cousin a loan for a house that she can't afford and puts her in severe financial trouble, she might very well not use that bank again the next time she's looking for a loan (in maybe 30 years), but that doesn't help much.

The free market self regulates well in some areas. Others need some assistance.

Re: California law requires businesses to let you cancel your subscription online

#396
In the UK the easiest way is to just cancel your direct debit. This usually promptd the business to cancel your membership and usually follows up with some letters to demand extra payment. You could safely ignore these letters, even if it comes from a credit collection agency, and the court will side with you if you explain the complexity in getting out of these contracts.

Re: California law requires businesses to let you cancel your subscription online

#397

Thank god for that. I made the mistake of joining a Goodlife gym in Canada many moons ago... The place was disgusting. Always crowded. Mould growing in the bathrooms. Stunk very badly, etc... So I stopped going regularly... and one day I was in the area I decided to stop in and cancel my membership. "Oh sorry, you'll need to make an appointment with management in order to cancel." "OK, is a manager in right now?" "Ye…

> When my turn came... I just said "I'm moving to england and I don't know a single person here who might want to absorb my contract". I actually came here to say the same thing. I realized “I’m moving” was the best way to get results in these situations when I was actually moving out of the country for a bit. It’s like a magical incantation that immediately gets them to stop trying to upsell or retain you, no questi…

I've actually started mastering this technique and using it where it makes sense. When a salesperson tries to get you - always be a buyer but a buyer of something they aren't selling. I think it's like the Benjamin Franklin technique where you build up immediate rapport and control by getting the other person to do something for you. So by asking for something it's like saying "parlay" in Pirates of the Caribbean. It stops them from their normal process.

Example: on the Vegas strip they always have people selling strip clubs and pestering you. I'll say "can't do that tonight but do you have any (insert legit magician) tickets?"

They'll go oh man sorry don't have those tonight. Was going to get some, oh shoot. Have a nice night and take care!!!!

It's like the sale that got away. You're still cool to them so they back off.

I do this with the CD artists - don't have a CD player, you streaming? Nah man.

So always be a buyer of whatever they don't have to sell haha.

Re: California law requires businesses to let you cancel your subscription online

#398

Honestly, the best way to handle these things is to forget even bothering with the company and file a charge-back with your bank or Visa/Mastercard. You have every right to call up your bank and deny a charge for a service you're not using, and didn't ask to renew. Plus it's guaranteed to get the charge removed immediately, and you'll be hurting the company by adding to their charge-back tally, increasing payment pro…

I wouldn't advise telling people to do chargebacks often. They're meant to be used when venues of negotiation with the company are exhausted and you still believe they're in the wrong. If your bank suspects you're being too liberal with them, they will cut you off, as they'll suspect you're the fraudster.

I mean how often do you have to cancel gym memberships and newspapers?

Re: California law requires businesses to let you cancel your subscription online

#399

Earlier quoted context omitted.

PayPal tried to take money from my checking account because Consumer Reports "autorenewed" my subscription -- without my knowledge or explicit authorization. As soon as I saw this I reported this as an unauthorized transaction on PayPal. But PayPal failed to stop the payment in time, even though at the time of my flagging it was unpaid. I then called BofA and blocked PayPal and that worked. So at the moment I have a…

>PayPal tried to take money from my checking account because Consumer Reports "autorenewed" my subscription -- without my knowledge or explicit authorization. The only way this happens is you create a "billing agreement" when you first signup. Its a feature of Paypal that then lets sites bill more stuff to you without much in terms of prompting. Its useful because services like Steam use it to avoid prompting users o…

Yes, I think that is what I use to pay for Netflix.

Re: California law requires businesses to let you cancel your subscription online

#400

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is not guaranteed. The company has a chance to respond with the paperwork proving that you in fact received the item you paid for. It's then up to you to prove that you did not. I am not a lawyer, but this is what happened to me.

I honestly can not understand how a credit card company call center can claim to legally decide a civil matter like this. I know in the US they regularly do this just as I know of a couple of counties that absolutely don't allow it. I honestly wonder what legal theory my bank or financial service is using to justify transferring my money or incurring debt under my name to pay someone I explicitly tell them not to sim…

The "legal theory" is that you signed up for the credit card company to be a trusted middle man and to ajudicate exactly these sorts of disputes. This is part of value they provide.
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