Is Vertical Farming Really the Future of Agriculture? • Hacker News Board

Re: Is Vertical Farming Really the Future of Agriculture?

#11

Post by nordsieck » Thu, Jul 05, 2018, 11:10 PM UTC

pascalxus wrote: post #4

Why don't they just do it without all those expensive lights and equipment, that's where all the biggest expsenses are. Just straight hydroponics with vertical farming. am i missing something? EDIT: I mean, do it outdoors with vertical farming, either on rooftops or around offices or parks or just outside the city (better there than 6000 miles away). the vertical aspect of it would still help reduce costs since real-…

1. Clean room farming means no need for pesticides

2. LED lights are pretty efficient, and they provide another avenue for optimization (e.g. color, intensity, timing, etc.). Whether or not those optimizations are financially effective is probably situationally dependent.

3. LED lights provide latitude independence. No idea if this is a serious reason, but I could see it being of interest to Iceland.

Re: Is Vertical Farming Really the Future of Agriculture?

#12

Post by chao- » Thu, Jul 05, 2018, 11:10 PM UTC

pascalxus wrote: post #4

Why don't they just do it without all those expensive lights and equipment, that's where all the biggest expsenses are. Just straight hydroponics with vertical farming. am i missing something? EDIT: I mean, do it outdoors with vertical farming, either on rooftops or around offices or parks or just outside the city (better there than 6000 miles away). the vertical aspect of it would still help reduce costs since real-…

This is very back of the napkin guesswork, but here goes:

If part of the pitch is that, more than just "vertical" farming, it is "vertical urban" farming (e.g. for logistical advantage of proximity to demand), that would imply potential proximity to other tall structures in a city. Probably taller structures. You would have concerns for consistency of sunlight. Also only the edges of the building would get it, so you would want your farm to only occupy the tiniest edge footprint of the building, but across multiple floors. That is an odd sort of lease to get from a building.

Even a new building built nearby after a year or two could destroy the efficiency of your once-carefully-selected site.

Another under-educated guess that I would be happy to hear about from someone more knowledge: I would guess that glass facades costs more than other materials.

Re: Is Vertical Farming Really the Future of Agriculture?

#13

Post by bryanlarsen » Thu, Jul 05, 2018, 11:11 PM UTC

You can buy prime farm land in Saskatchewan for well under $2000 an acre.

Re: Is Vertical Farming Really the Future of Agriculture?

#14

Post by rasmusei » Thu, Jul 05, 2018, 11:12 PM UTC

pascalxus wrote: post #4

Why don't they just do it without all those expensive lights and equipment, that's where all the biggest expsenses are. Just straight hydroponics with vertical farming. am i missing something? EDIT: I mean, do it outdoors with vertical farming, either on rooftops or around offices or parks or just outside the city (better there than 6000 miles away). the vertical aspect of it would still help reduce costs since real-…

Yes, you seem to be missing the light supply. Plants need a lot of light to grow. In a multi-storey greenhouse, the incoming solar radiation per unit floor area is smaller than in a normal (one-storey) greenhouse. Thus the need for artificial lighting and associated costs, both for hardware and electric power.

Re: Is Vertical Farming Really the Future of Agriculture?

#15

Post by antisthenes » Thu, Jul 05, 2018, 11:19 PM UTC

Clearly not, because there's nothing inherently new in arranging shelves vertically.

It's almost as comical as alluding that the hanging gardens of Babylon disrupted ancient farming and were used for the production of food.

Re: Is Vertical Farming Really the Future of Agriculture?

#16

Post by xanthopan » Thu, Jul 05, 2018, 11:21 PM UTC

nordsieck wrote: post #11

pascalxus wrote: post #4

Why don't they just do it without all those expensive lights and equipment, that's where all the biggest expsenses are. Just straight hydroponics with vertical farming. am i missing something? EDIT: I mean, do it outdoors with vertical farming, either on rooftops or around offices or parks or just outside the city (better there than 6000 miles away). the vertical aspect of it would still help reduce costs since real-…

1. Clean room farming means no need for pesticides 2. LED lights are pretty efficient, and they provide another avenue for optimization (e.g. color, intensity, timing, etc.). Whether or not those optimizations are financially effective is probably situationally dependent. 3. LED lights provide latitude independence. No idea if this is a serious reason, but I could see it being of interest to Iceland.

1. OTOH, it also means there's now a need for manual pollination.

Re: Is Vertical Farming Really the Future of Agriculture?

#17

Post by thewizardofaus » Thu, Jul 05, 2018, 11:24 PM UTC

antisthenes wrote: post #15

Clearly not, because there's nothing inherently new in arranging shelves vertically. It's almost as comical as alluding that the hanging gardens of Babylon disrupted ancient farming and were used for the production of food.

Welcome to sillycon valley

Re: Is Vertical Farming Really the Future of Agriculture?

#18

Post by tathougies » Thu, Jul 05, 2018, 11:24 PM UTC

xanthopan wrote: post #16

nordsieck wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1. Clean room farming means no need for pesticides 2. LED lights are pretty efficient, and they provide another avenue for optimization (e.g. color, intensity, timing, etc.). Whether or not those optimizations are financially effective is probably situationally dependent. 3. LED lights provide latitude independence. No idea if this is a serious reason, but I could see it being of interest to Iceland.

1. OTOH, it also means there's now a need for manual pollination.

1. Leafy greens don't need pollination. It's in your best interest to avoid flowering if you want product anyone will eat.

2. Very few food plants are dioecious, and the ones that are (like asparagus and dates) are either ones where the fruit don't matter or are not likely to be grown indoors

Re: Is Vertical Farming Really the Future of Agriculture?

#19

Post by tathougies » Thu, Jul 05, 2018, 11:25 PM UTC

antisthenes wrote: post #15

Clearly not, because there's nothing inherently new in arranging shelves vertically. It's almost as comical as alluding that the hanging gardens of Babylon disrupted ancient farming and were used for the production of food.

Hydroponic farming can save 95% of water used to produce food. To say that that advantage is not 'inherently new' is to do it a disservice.

Re: Is Vertical Farming Really the Future of Agriculture?

#20

Post by tathougies » Thu, Jul 05, 2018, 11:27 PM UTC

pascalxus wrote: post #10

i wonder what the nutritional content of those veggies are compared to their ground grown counterparts.

Can't speak for these companies in particular, but hydroponic vegetables aren't particularly susceptible to being less nutritious. Plants make most of what they need from the air, water, and nutrients you give them. If they lack in one of those, the plant will likely wilt or die. Otherwise, the data typically shows that the vegetables are as nutritious, or likely more nutritious, since the plants have everything they need to grow, and it's in the plant's evolutionary best interest to put all their nutrition into the fruits.